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xbokilla

xbokilla

12 pointer
Jun 28, 2012
15,704
Iceman35 said:
I disagree. UK showed they could simply not compete with that level of team defense. Indiana doesn't have a great team, and benefitted from the most unbalanced Big 10 schedule I've ever seen, but they still compete in the Big 10. Easily the best all-around conference this year, and one that emphasizes team defense more than scoring.

As Wisconsin showed last year, when the talent disparity isn't as great UK is used to, the better team will win, which is what happened last night.


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Not arguing but I think a lot of teams still playing would like to have UKs talent. With that being said, the SEC must not only be bad but awful. If there's that much disparity between what UK plays during the year vs post season...


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Iceman35

Iceman35

12 pointer
Oct 27, 2008
7,987
Boone County
xbokilla said:
Not arguing but I think a lot of teams still playing would like to have UKs talent. With that being said, the SEC must not only be bad but awful. If there's that much disparity between what UK plays during the year vs post season...


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I agree that UK has superior talent, that many teams would desire, but as has been shown in recent tournaments, they get beat when the gap between them and the talent of the opposing team shrinks. That's when superior coaching, and overall better team play wins.

Beyond UK, the SEC is pretty thin talent wise, especially defensively, compared to other conferences.


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reivertom

reivertom

12 pointer
Dec 17, 2007
7,546
Greenup Co.
They lost because they are inconsistent and have been all year. You can have all the talent in the country and if you have games like last night, off and on, where you can't hit the broad side of a barn, you won't advance at tourney level. They have had these games all year where they just fall apart at the first sign of trouble. They are no doubt good players, but as a group they just couldn't get it done.
 
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K

kymailman98

10 pointer
Dec 20, 2009
1,838
Christian County
reivertom said:
They lost because they are inconsistent and have been all year. You can have all the talent in the country and if you have games like last night, off and on, where you can't hit the broad side of a barn, you won't advance at tourney level. They have had these games all year where they just fall apart at the first sign of trouble. They are no doubt good players, but as a group they just couldn't get it done.
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Agree.....this was a team that blew a 21 point lead to Tennessee, and lost to a terrible Auburn team. They had talent, they just didn't play up to the level they could have. I still think Ulis and Murray was the best backcourt UK has had in a while....when Murray was scoring. But, I also think Murray was given too much free rein and took some bad shots when he had teammates who were open. I think they were more talented than Indiana, but that the Hoosiers outplayed them when it counted.
 
Recurve77

Recurve77

10 pointer
Aug 7, 2012
1,642
stevenvalleyagain said:
Do you really think that duke will be preseason number 1 with UK bringing in what my be the best recruiting class ever? We have seen over and over that UK is preseason number 1 almost every year based on the incoming class. With this being what many are calling Cals best class, why would next season be any different?
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If you guys check out Ken Pomeroy's 2016-2017 preseason computer projections you both may just be a little surprised. Neither Duke or Ky are #1!
 
ptbrauch

ptbrauch

12 pointer
Nov 10, 2004
11,024
The OC
Iceman35 said:
..., but as has been shown in recent tournaments, ...
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Which recent ones? The final four in 2015? Or are you referring to the championship game loss in 2014? Maybe the championship in 2012? Or the final four finish in 2011? The elite 8 finish in 2010?

Or do you mean before Calipari was coach?
 
Iceman35

Iceman35

12 pointer
Oct 27, 2008
7,987
Boone County
ptbrauch said:
Which recent ones? The final four in 2015? Or are you referring to the championship game loss in 2014? Maybe the championship in 2012? Or the final four finish in 2011? The elite 8 finish in 2010?

Or do you mean before Calipari was coach?
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All of them actually. When they won the championship in 2012, they had overwhelming talent compared to their opponents, and that made up for the deficiency in team play.

In the other years you referenced, but especially 2015, they had a higher level of talent, but the gap was much narrower, and were eventually beat by better "teams". Last years loss to Wisconsin proves it.

I'm not saying I wouldn't want my school tom have a decade of Final Four runs like that, just that the amazing talent that Calipari brings in every year does have its limits.


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Brsutton86

Brsutton86

12 pointer
Sep 19, 2009
2,704
Harrodsburg, KY
Iceman35 said:
All of them actually. When they won the championship in 2012, they had overwhelming talent compared to their opponents, and that made up for the deficiency in team play.

In the other years you referenced, but especially 2015, they had a higher level of talent, but the gap was much narrower, and were eventually beat by better "teams". Last years loss to Wisconsin proves it.

I'm not saying I wouldn't want my school tom have a decade of Final Four runs like that, just that the amazing talent that Calipari brings in every year does have its limits.


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You clearly dont follow college hoops. The best team of the year hardly ever wins the tournament. It's what makes the the madness in march. Deifiecency in team play in 2012? Are you kidding? It was one of the the best unselfish teams to ever where the blue jersey.

Murray was cold, Ulis had no help without him. The big guys just weren't high caliber inside players. Willis didn't step up or Briscoe to fill any gap. It was Ulis vs Indy. If Murray was shooting normal we would have won easy. He went 1 for 7 on 3s. Outside of the guards the team lacked and was sure to get knocked out as soon as Murray or Ulis at an off night shooting. Bring on next season, I'll enjoy some more Cal Kool aid.
 
B

BTOWNER

8 pointer
Dec 5, 2010
538
Brsutton86 said:
You clearly dont follow college hoops. The best team of the year hardly ever wins the tournament. It's what makes the the madness in march. Deifiecency in team play in 2012? Are you kidding? It was one of the the best unselfish teams to ever where the blue jersey.

Murray was cold, Ulis had no help without him. The big guys just weren't high caliber inside players. Willis didn't step up or Briscoe to fill any gap. It was Ulis vs Indy. If Murray was shooting normal we would have won easy. He went 1 for 7 on 3s. Outside of the guards the team lacked and was sure to get knocked out as soon as Murray or Ulis at an off night shooting. Bring on next season, I'll enjoy some more Cal Kool aid.
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Well said.......


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Iceman35

Iceman35

12 pointer
Oct 27, 2008
7,987
Boone County
Brsutton86 said:
You clearly dont follow college hoops. The best team of the year hardly ever wins the tournament. It's what makes the the madness in march. Deifiecency in team play in 2012? Are you kidding? It was one of the the best unselfish teams to ever where the blue jersey.

Murray was cold, Ulis had no help without him. The big guys just weren't high caliber inside players. Willis didn't step up or Briscoe to fill any gap. It was Ulis vs Indy. If Murray was shooting normal we would have won easy. He went 1 for 7 on 3s. Outside of the guards the team lacked and was sure to get knocked out as soon as Murray or Ulis at an off night shooting. Bring on next season, I'll enjoy some more Cal Kool aid.
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I follow college hoops quite regularly. Any team in the top 10-15 has a legit shot at the title year in and year out.

The 2012 team was clearly the best team Calipari has ever had, and probably ever will. The team game played by them was also the best he'll probably ever get, assuming his recruiting style stays the same. What I meant in regards to that 2012 team is that it was so overwhelming in talent, any deficiencies in team play it may, or may not, have had were vastly overshadowed by that talent.

Contrast that with last year where UK still had more talent than Wisconsin, but was beaten on the team play.


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K

kymailman98

10 pointer
Dec 20, 2009
1,838
Christian County
Iceman35 said:
I follow college hoops quite regularly. Any team in the top 10-15 has a legit shot at the title year in and year out.

The 2012 team was clearly the best team Calipari has ever had, and probably ever will. The team game played by them was also the best he'll probably ever get, assuming his recruiting style stays the same. What I meant in regards to that 2012 team is that it was so overwhelming in talent, any deficiencies in team play it may, or may not, have had were vastly overshadowed by that talent.

Contrast that with last year where UK still had more talent than Wisconsin, but was beaten on the team play.


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You are right. When a kid knows he is only going to be there one year, there is no way he is going to buy into the concept of a "team", as opposed to a group of players who have been there for several years. These one and doners, while usually being the best players in the country, are on the fast track to the NBA, and that's mostly what's on their mind. As great a player as Murray was for us this year, it was obvious many times that he passed up his teammates in order to take a shot himself. He was just showing the scouts what he could do. Calipari's coaching philosophy is simple....recruit the best players he can, put then out there for a year or at the most two, and try to beat the opposition's best players. He recruits players, not a team, and he does win a lot of games....but he also loses some games when he comes up against teams that play together really good.
 
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