- Oct 15, 2009
I'd just carry concealed and no one would know...
Ok. I agree with BigPuddin's argument. You make a very valid point. Our rights end where someone else's start.
However, Ace has a valid point here too. If you can legally carry past the sign in KY, why wouldn't you? If you believe in carrying to protect yourself and your family, why would you allow anyone to effectively disarm you during ingress and egress of their facility? In all likelihood, if you ever need your weapon, it will be in one of those situations where you are going into or exiting some establishment of some kind and somebody gets the drop on you. If the law is ever changed to the point that these signs have any legal validity, then I will comply, but not a minute before. Why bother to even conceal and carry if the gun is gonna spend 80% of the time in your car because some corporate office in liberal America doesn't think citizens are smart enough to be trusted? If you are doing it right, no one but you will know it is in the building.
And yes, I totally agree with the voting with your wallet piece too. No one is forcing me to choose an establishment that has such a policy. I rarely go to BDubs because of their policy. When I do go, the sign is ignored, I have my wings, no one gets injured, and no one ever knows I was in violation. IMO, that is why the law is structured as is. If you can carry responsibly, and keep it concealed, then no harm, no foul. If you are an idiot, you will be made quickly and asked to leave the premises for your lack of intelligence. You don't comply, then the law is involved. Seems like a nice middle ground for the rights of businesses and individuals to me.
As for Ohio, if the sign is legally binding there, then you are breaking the law of the land by ignoring it, and you do so at your own peril.
My thing is this. When you open a business, it becomes private and public property. What I mean is I can't go into a business and get blasted drunk and act like an idiot and claim I'm on private property so I should be immune to public laws. I may be on property that is owned by someone, but it is still a public place .
We had this discussion with smoking. Just because you own the restaurant, it doesn't give you the right to make your own laws under that roof. It is open to the public, and as a business operating in a certain city or state, you must operate under their laws and regulations. To make the argument some of you are is like saying, "Well, I own then business so I can serve alcohol after 1am, because I own the property." You can't legally do that just because you "own" the business if the local or state govt. doesn't allow it. It sounds as if some of you would argue that you can do what you want because it's yours.
I totally agree with you guys IF it were a private, members only club not open to the general public. I say smoke all you want and kick anyone with a gun out-if you want.
How I look at it is nobody is disarming you. Nobody is making you walk into that establishment. Nowhere does it say you have the right to go out to eat. That is a privilege that you can enjoy by following the rules of the establishment.
Of course this is my opinion. And yes apparently the law allows you to disregard the wishes of the owner in his own place of business but that's just not for me. Same as if I invited a bunch of guys over for a wingding and asked that since alcohol was going to be drank that everyone left their pistols at home. I would expect you to honor that.
I believe they should be able to do as they want. That's where we differ you agree with government intrusion into the private sector of business and I do not.
It's more of a one strike thing that the business owner only ask you to leave once. If you repeatedly do it ... there's no free pass just because you have a CDWL.
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I just think that if you want to keep lawful gun owners out of the business, then you should be able to justify it. I might understand, I might not, but I've yet to hear WHY this is a good idea?