The Magic Crossbow

JDMiller

12 pointer
Jun 12, 2005
10,781
" Between the Rivers "
sirgiovanni said:
You said spear! I love you man! But not in that brokedown mountain kinda way. You are now officially number 2 on my hero list.

Hey.........I'm for it . However we would need to define a few things.

1. If you held it in a position ...in a hunting situation....that was ready for a imediate throw at a game animal .....would that be considered full draw. If so.......spear chuckers would have a definite advantage and could have a devistating effect to our resources.

2. Range..........Effective range and kinetic energy would soely depend on the spear manufacture and physical abillity of the user. A highly trained spear chucker using todays modern manufactured spears could easily take game at extreme yardages. The mortality rates can increase from the "slob" spear chuckers taking unethyical shots at deer sized game at long ranges.

3. Safety........being in the woods with spear chuckers walking around with their spear at ready could be a hazzard. We should consider the hunter orange requirement for all spear chuckers and possibly a cerification for those users.

4. Then we need to think about all the non-resident spear chuckers that will be coming to Kentucky to have the opportunity to hunt the early season and harvest one of our VELVET B/C Class bucks. It has been estimated that there are at least...100,000000000,00000000 spear chuckers wanting to come to Kentucky. This is bound to create more pressure on our WMA's , interstates , county roads , McDonalds and not to mention our Wal-Marts.

We need to think about the effects and debate this for a few years before rushing into this one. There are too many unknowns and we should not use any data from other states where spears have been used for a long time.....way too many differences to compare them to Kentucky to create the longest spear chucking season in the nation.

SORRY........It's Friday and I just couldnt resist ! :D :D :D :D :D
 

Multidigits

BBBC Members
Dec 10, 2001
17,760
Vine Grove, Ky, USA.
JDMiller said:
Hey.........I'm for it . However we would need to define a few things.

1. If you held it in a position ...in a hunting situation....that was ready for a imediate throw at a game animal .....would that be considered full draw. If so.......spear chuckers would have a definite advantage and could have a devistating effect to our resources.

2. Range..........Effective range and kinetic energy would soely depend on the spear manufacture and physical abillity of the user. A highly trained spear chucker using todays modern manufactured spears could easily take game at extreme yardages. The mortality rates can increase from the "slob" spear chuckers taking unethyical shots at deer sized game at long ranges.

3. Safety........being in the woods with spear chuckers walking around with their spear at ready could be a hazzard. We should consider the hunter orange requirement for all spear chuckers and possibly a cerification for those users.

4. Then we need to think about all the non-resident spear chuckers that will be coming to Kentucky to have the opportunity to hunt the early season and harvest one of our VELVET B/C Class bucks. It has been estimated that there are at least...100,000000000,00000000 spear chuckers wanting to come to Kentucky. This is bound to create more pressure on our WMA's , interstates , county roads , McDonalds and not to mention our Wal-Marts.

We need to think about the effects and debate this for a few years before rushing into this one. There are too many unknowns and we should not use any data from other states where spears have been used for a long time.....way too many differences to compare them to Kentucky to create the longest spear chucking season in the nation.

SORRY........It's Friday and I just couldnt resist ! :D :D :D :D :D

Plus we'll need a couple of surveys along the way......:rolleyes:
 

Willie

12 pointer
May 10, 2003
2,669
JDMiller said:
Hey.........I'm for it . However we would need to define a few things.

I think it would bring more women into hunting..

JLOHuntingJpeg.jpg
 

Xtreme

Cyber-Hunter
Dec 12, 2001
3,117
.
Xtreme

I won't get into whether SB211 is stupid or not as I'm sick of all the arguments but I will say there are a heck of a lot of folks who think otherwise. As for the difficulty in getting the impaired permit I don't know who your doctor is but I know for a fact in most cases it is easy as falling off a log to get. I even asked my doctor that "if" I were to experience pain or physical difficulties in drawing my bow would he sign my permit and the answer was "of course".

Happy anniversary:D
 

Duster

12 pointer
Dec 14, 2001
17,801
Up in the woods above Lake Malone
Xtreme said:
As for the difficulty in getting the impaired permit I don't know who your doctor is but I know for a fact in most cases it is easy as falling off a log to get. I even asked my doctor that "if" I were to experience pain or physical difficulties in drawing my bow would he sign my permit and the answer was "of course".

And your point is ? Are you one of those who think a person should be missing a limb to qualifiy. I had guys in the club I belong to for 15 years stand and tell me to learn to shoot a regular bow by drawing it with my teeth..hard to do with dentures ya know. Your doctor would be doing the right thing on your behalf if drawing a veritical bow caused you pain or physical difficulties. Ther is a couple boxes that the doctor can check...Temp or Permanant. Most doctors unless they have treated the patent for more than a year check the Temp box. Remember YOU ask the question that crossbow permit will not drop out of the sky and land at your feet . As to being easy doctors are trained on matters of pain and the KDFWR trust them to make the decision if they fill out the paperwork. It has not been that way long, you used to have the paperwork filled out and then send it to the state for permit issue. I guess in order to save needed $$$ that was changed.
 
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Multidigits

BBBC Members
Dec 10, 2001
17,760
Vine Grove, Ky, USA.
Xtreme said:
I won't get into whether SB211 is stupid or not as I'm sick of all the arguments but I will say there are a heck of a lot of folks who think otherwise. As for the difficulty in getting the impaired permit I don't know who your doctor is but I know for a fact in most cases it is easy as falling off a log to get. I even asked my doctor that "if" I were to experience pain or physical difficulties in drawing my bow would he sign my permit and the answer was "of course".

Happy anniversary:D

They are only easy to get if your disabled, if not, then you can't get one legally. That's not the answer why expansion is desired. The sportsmen have spoke via a survey and the message is strong.

As for SB 211, everyone should be against it--crossbow foe or not.
 

Willie

12 pointer
May 10, 2003
2,669
Xtreme said:
I won't get into whether SB211 is stupid or not as I'm sick of all the arguments but I will say there are a heck of a lot of folks who think otherwise. As for the difficulty in getting the impaired permit I don't know who your doctor is but I know for a fact in most cases it is easy as falling off a log to get. I even asked my doctor that "if" I were to experience pain or physical difficulties in drawing my bow would he sign my permit and the answer was "of course".

Happy anniversary:D

Sorry extreme, but I don't understand what you are getting at. Please explain....

You said -"I won't get into whether SB211 is stupid or not as I'm sick of all the arguments but I will say there are a heck of a lot of folks who think otherwise."

Are they actually for SB211? Or sick of the arguments? Or what?

I think 99.9% of the people are sick of the arguments and want this thing settled once and for all..

If someone is FOR SB211 they are throwing out the baby with the bath water. It is setting a VERY dangerous precedent of allowing politicians to set any kind of widllife season.

Do you not agree?

BTW - The discussion was not about how difficult or easy it was to get a physically challenged permit, but how a couple of dunderhead senators in their haste to draw up an anti-crossbow bill left out the physically challenged hunters.

Now if they did that people would have to question their logic on the bill at all.
 

Multidigits

BBBC Members
Dec 10, 2001
17,760
Vine Grove, Ky, USA.
Guys, take it easy on my pal Xtreme. He's been sick lately and might qualify for a permit if he slips just a tad more. He's not on our side, but he's not realyy against some expansion either. Peace.
 

Xtreme

Cyber-Hunter
Dec 12, 2001
3,117
.
Xtreme

Willie said:
Sorry extreme, but I don't understand what you are getting at. Please explain....

You said -"I won't get into whether SB211 is stupid or not as I'm sick of all the arguments but I will say there are a heck of a lot of folks who think otherwise."

Are they actually for SB211? Or sick of the arguments? Or what?

I think 99.9% of the people are sick of the arguments and want this thing settled once and for all..

If someone is FOR SB211 they are throwing out the baby with the bath water. It is setting a VERY dangerous precedent of allowing politicians to set any kind of widllife season.

Do you not agree?

BTW - The discussion was not about how difficult or easy it was to get a physically challenged permit, but how a couple of dunderhead senators in their haste to draw up an anti-crossbow bill left out the physically challenged hunters.

Now if they did that people would have to question their logic on the bill at all.

There are a lot of folks in favor of SB211. Whether or not this is wrong or dangerous is of course debateable. The fact remains that this bill has a tremendous amount of support. As for leaving out disabled hunters as I understand this bill it is a bill to leave the seasons as they are and this does not change anything for disabled hunters as I understand it. Also to answer the second part of your question there are hundreds if not thousands of us[me included] that are sick of this whole mess and regret very deeply the divides and wedges that this has placed between hunters.

My concern from the beginning is how will this affect a declining deer herd and WMA impacts. I have from the very beginning been willing to accept a expanded xbow season as long as the afore mentioned concerns were not terribly affected. As a representative of three different organizations I have tried my best to see all of the angles and potentiol pitfalls including my own concerns.

We've already been down this road for a thousand miles already. Looks like we have a couple hundred more to go.

As for SB211? General William Tecumseh Sherman said it best when he said...."war is hell":(
 

Xtreme

Cyber-Hunter
Dec 12, 2001
3,117
.
Xtreme

Duster said:
And your point is ? Are you one of those who think a person should be missing a limb to qualifiy. I had guys in the club I belong to for 15 years stand and tell me to learn to shoot a regular bow by drawing it with my teeth..hard to do with dentures ya know. Your doctor would be doing the right thing on your behalf if drawing a veritical bow caused you pain or physical difficulties. Ther is a couple boxes that the doctor can check...Temp or Permanant. Most doctors unless they have treated the patent for more than a year check the Temp box. Remember YOU ask the question that crossbow permit will not drop out of the sky and land at your feet . As to being easy doctors are trained on matters of pain and the KDFWR trust them to make the decision if they fill out the paperwork. It has not been that way long, you used to have the paperwork filled out and then send it to the state for permit issue. I guess in order to save needed $$$ that was changed.

No....my point is that you DON'T have to be a parapalegic to get the permit!! If you have pain and or difficulty drawing or shooting a bow you SHOULD BY ALL MEANS BE ALLOWED TO USE AN XBOW AS ARCHERY EQUIP>!!

As for the pain issue? Any good doctor will tell you that there is no way to medically judge the amount of pain a person feels. Of course it's a no brainer if you come up on an accident and a person is missing a limb that they are in pain but as far as back pain, shoulder pain , arthritis, bursitis etc. there simply is no formula to judge pain.

C'mon Duster, you are a moderator and I know you are smart enough to know all of this.
 

Duster

12 pointer
Dec 14, 2001
17,801
Up in the woods above Lake Malone
My formula to judge pain is if I have to take pain medication in order to sleep after trying to shoot a bow is good enough for me. I ain't talking about a asprin here I am talking about the stuff where you can't feel your toes for several hours after downing one....:D
 

Willie

12 pointer
May 10, 2003
2,669
Xtreme said:
There are a lot of folks in favor of SB211. Whether or not this is wrong or dangerous is of course debateable. The fact remains that this bill has a tremendous amount of support. ..............

You actually mean there are people out there that hate crossbows so much that they would give up control of the wildlfe to politicians? Surely they are not that misguided?

As for SB211? General William Tecumseh Sherman said it best when he said...."war is hell":(

And this one could be nuclear for the KDF&WR..

Think about it..
 

Xtreme

Cyber-Hunter
Dec 12, 2001
3,117
.
Xtreme

Sadly enough the term "hate crossbows" is a term by which we now judge the standards of this most dire and regrettable conflict.

I think the common denominator is are we losing a season that many to include Fred Bear fought so hard for? I think and fear that most of us are [the anti xbow crowd]afraid of losing a season that was and has been hard fought for. Not to mention the resource issues.

I will gladly admit that a xbow season does not require one to wear orange but the encroaching and impending fear of a "shoot what you bring" season wears on my mind as well as the impact on the resource and public hunting capacities.

I'm not a smart man but I fear the day that when we all will need each other we will have drawn so many lines in the sand and have cast so many ill words against one another that none of us will be able to stand together.

Aint war hell?
 

Willie

12 pointer
May 10, 2003
2,669
No one is making anyone lay down their favorite bow and pick up a crossbow ..... so no one is losing anything....
 

Xtreme

Cyber-Hunter
Dec 12, 2001
3,117
.
Xtreme

Willie said:
No one is making anyone lay down their favorite bow and pick up a crossbow ..... so no one is losing anything....

I've had a weak moment where I allowed myself to be pulled into an issue that is passionate to me. I will now go back into the corner and just observe once again.

You boys take care and whatever happens just make sure your arrows or bolts fly true.

Peace.
 


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