Night hunting for coyotes with a air gun .

Discussion in 'Varmint Hunting' started by hatsan125sniper, Jul 1, 2018.

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  1. riverboss

    riverboss 12 pointer

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    Why would someone spend so much for so little performance?
    I can buy a 22 rimfire for $100.00 dollars and have a gun that will do anything a pellet gun will do and still be cheaper and more fun to shoot.

    I can put a suppressor on it and still be cheaper than alot of pellet guns and not have to worry about air tanks and all the crap that goes with one. It's not a better mouse trap it's just marketing trying to convince you they are!
    Animals deserve to be put down humanely and using a toy with barely enough power to do the job is just ridiculous.
     
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  2. A 22 rimfire bullet can be deadly for a long ways away , so shooting them at night would be dangerous . That is why you cannot use them at night . with or with out a suppressor . The air gun is better because it safer and has the power to kill humanely at closer ranges . please watch the video I post .

    A air gun pellet travels less distance than the shotgun shell pellets do . Shotguns are legal to shoot coyotes at night even though hundreds of pellets that can travel over 300 yards but yet they do not allow a air gun that fires only one pellet going only 100 yards before it falls to the ground is not allowed .

    Also when nightvision is attached to the scope of the very accurate air guns its really hard to miss the coyote so there is really no safer gun to use at night .

    For night hunting its not about the money you spend on a gun its about how safe the gun is to the surrounding area like homes , people other animals ect .

    The accuracy of of the air gun is like a 22 lr but the ft pound energy FPE is less than a shot gun shell . Which makes it the best gun for coyotes at night . Not only is it safer than a shotgun its super quiet so it doesn't scare off the coyotes, all they do is run a short distance then they come back to the downed coyote you just shot because they just hear a slight crack sound kind of like a stick being stepped on which to the coyote thinks was another animal like a deer or racoon breaking a stick they stepped on .That why you can get more than one coyote in a short amount of time .

    As for the air gun being a toy and not having enough power , to kill a coyote you must have not watched the video, watch it again . All you need to kill a coyote is around 20 fpe. so the air gun can kill a coyote very humanely. The air gun used to drop the coyote like a rock was a 930 fps 22 caliber airgun using a 18 grain pellet . Which is more than enough power as you can see in the video .

    You don't have to spend a lot of money on a air gun or you don't have to buy one that uses a bottle of Air . You can get a air gun with the same power level you see in the video that downed the coyote where it stood for around 100.00 . air guns have different power plants in them the ones that use a tank of are are called pcp's pre -charged pneumatic . meaning the gun stores compressed air in a on board cylinder which can allow 60 to 80 shots in a 22 cal 930 fps range.

    Another power plant is a compressed spring that sets behind a piston with a seal on the top of the piston , the piston fits inside a cylinder . when the barrel or side level or bottom level is cocked it brings the piston the the far end of the cylinder and when the trigger is pulled the spring forces the air through the cylinder which in turn forces the pellet out of the gun .

    The other type is a newer type that is called gas ram . It works the same way as a spring piston does but instead of a spring a self contained piston is used they are like the same as the gas shocks that are used to hold up the car hoods or rear hatch on a suv .

    The 4th type is the weaker type that you might have had growing up and that a pump up pneumatic . This air gun once pumped up ten times or so and stores the air in a small tank just big enough to get one shot from it that puts out about 400 to 600 fps . which is good for small animals like birds birds ,squirrel, rabbets and head shots on Turkey out to 20 yards or so .

    Theses 4 types of air guns are all self contained and no tank is needed , only the pcp's need a tank or a foot pump .

    Todays modern airguns are not toys ,they are adult air guns that are made for hunting and precision target shooting .

    The modern air guns that use a 50 caliber bullet can kill a elk so you see they are not toys so please don't put them in the hands of a younger hunter until they know gun safety because it can kill them .

    What I'm trying to do is get the state to allow a airgun to be used to hunt coyotes at night so hunters can use a safe and silent gun to kill coyotes instead of forcing hunters to use the unsafe shotgun which is also a one and done hunt because of the ear deafening blast of the shotgun .

    If anyone would like to be able to use a air gun to kill coyotes at night please give the fish and wildlife a call and help me make it a legal weapon to use . Thank you .
     
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2018
  3. louisvillehunter

    louisvillehunter 6 pointer

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    I'm all for night hunting Coyotes and Hogs. There are many states that allow centerfire rifles at night. In fact I always leave this as a suggestion in the wildlife surveys.
    While I appreciate your argument I think the statement of 100 yard range is misleading. Pellets can travel much farther than that.
     
  4. EdLongshanks

    EdLongshanks 12 pointer

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    I’m all for air rifles and pretty much everything else....just don’t understand the overzealous and overbearing attitude
     
  5. riverboss

    riverboss 12 pointer

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    22 shorts are still a better weapon!
    Your right I didn't watch the video, and I'm not going to.
    Pellet guns don't interest me, they IMO
    Are a way of taking real guns away from hunters. If you tell some fool enough how good they are they will believe you. I'm not a fool!
    But good luck playing with inadequate weapons, I feel sorry for the marginal hit animals you shoot.
     
  6. Here is a graph of the flight of a 18 grain 930 fps pellet from 0 to 100 yards .

    As you can see the best distances to kill coyotes or Turkey is from 0 to say 50 yards.

    A shot gun shell pellets travel 300 yards .

    This graph shows what was used in the video of the coyote night hunt so you can see that 50 yards or less with this power will drop a coyote in its tracks .

    Air guns are also safe for surrounding homes or other things walking round in the middle of the night .

    What you have to say to yourself is would I be safer walking through the woods at night and have a better chance of getting hit by shotgun pellet spraying over 100 pellets flying in every direction for at least 300 yards or my one small single airgun pellet that drop after 100 yards ? I think the answer is pretty clear to me .

    Also remember the single pellet is being aimed at under a scope at a big coyote that is hard to miss at 50 yards or less so the chances of even that one pellet going past the coyote are just about zero percent , so take that into consideration when you compare a shot gun to a air gun .

    Yes they can travel farther but you have to aim the gun to the sky and I don't know any air gun hunters that are going to do that .

    The graph come from the chairgun program you can download fro free . You enter the muzzle velocity of your gun ,the weight of the pellet ,the BC of the pellet and the end distance you want . Once you do that the program shows the path of the pellet . I put the numbers of what you see in the video so you can see with the gun they used this would be the path of the pellet . You should download it and play around with it . If you need any help figuring the program out there are a bunch of you tube videos showing all the things the program can do or holler back at me and I will walk you through it . There is also a table that you can add next to the graph that shows the fpe and a bunch of other stats of every distance the pellet is at so you know what the fpe is at every distance . This lets you know if your pellet has enough fpe to kill the animal your after . It also shows the flight of the pellet through a mildot reticle . so you know what mildot to use at any given distance . You can also print out a scope cap mildot with the ranges showing what mildot to use at each distance . I will post some photos to show you what I mean .
    . 100 yards.png
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2018
  7. I don't know what to say if you're not even willing to watch a attached video of a coyote being dropped like a sack of rocks from 30 yards away .

    They don't interest you but you felt the need to come here and make a comment on something you know nothing about . Go figure. But I'm glad you did ,maybe you will learn something and maybe in time you will get interest in hunting with one once you find out they have plenty of power .

    Air guns hunting is not a way to take real guns away lol what are you some kind of conspiracy freak . Only dems are coming after your guns not air gun hunters . As for not being a fool well I'll just put a question mark next to that one ? I'm differently not a democrat trying to trick people out of there guns . If I ever become a dem Please shoot me on the spot because I would have to be out of my mind crazy bat shit .

    I just want to hunt coyotes at night and shoot them at close range say 50 yards or less with my night vision attached on my air gun that DOES have the power to drop them on the spot and do it safely and quietly that's all I swear nothing else .

    But I would like the help of other hunters that can see this as a very safe and effective way to hunt . I can tell now by all the comments I have received that there are no hunters here on this forum that know anything about hunting with a air gun except for Carl but that's okay I will try my best to educate everyone that wants to know about airguns and that wants to use them for Turkey and coyotes at night .

    I thought at first when I was reading everyone's comments that they were just trying to be a-holes until I realized they just don't know anything about this new way to hunt . So from now on I'm going to try to teach and help everyone understand just what a great weapon a air gun can be in just about every type of hunt you want to use it in . You just have to match the airgun and pellet size as in .177 up to 50 cal and fpe needed for the animal at any given distance .

    My goal is to just show they are safe , quiet , accurate and to get more people out there hunting with a air gun and also maybe talk to the fish and wildlife people to think about allowing the air gun to be used because I want to hunt Turkey during the day and coyotes at night here in KY with my air gun and I need everyone's support to make it happen . Not just for me but for everyone that wants to hunt with a airgun . Its just going to take more people talking to the fish ans wildlife officials to let them know people want this .

    So I quests in a way I am selling something . I'm selling a new way to hunt Turkey and coyotes hunting at night with a air gun . I can see this is not going to be easy to do but I'm going to give it a try and that's all anyone can do. I'll keep my threads limited and only start a new one once a month or so . I'm just not getting any younger and I would at least like to get out a few years and hunt before I get to old to take to the hills . I'm just a country boy wanting to hunt with my air guns.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2018
  8. Louisvillehunter I wish this forum would have a section for air guns so I could add this kind of info into it but the higher ups said no and ended my post so no one else could say they wanted it or not . They shout my post down with in a week not giving any one a chance to comment . I thought that was very strange . It was like the friends tv show and the soup nazi that said no soup for you . O well maybe some day they will add the only other weapon that is legal to use in the state of KY that they didn't make a section for .

    Any ways here is the chair gun link https://uk.hawkeoptics.com/chairgun.html
    Here is a photo showing the scope cap mildot distances of the gun and pellet you are going to use you can make different caps showing different pellet weights to match the gus fps . As you can see in the photo if you wanted to shoot at something between 33 and 50 yards you would use the 6th mil dot up. Each gun that has a different power level will show a different distance next to the mildot . I like to set my scope up so at 50 yards the pellet will be dead center the cross hairs . On a air gun that is shooting say 930 fps there will be more distances on the same mildot because the pellet is flying flatter longer something like 25 to 50 on the same mildot or close to it . http://198.154.244.69/blog/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/NE-Championship-and-Pistol-ft-010.jpg
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2018
  9. EdLongshanks

    EdLongshanks 12 pointer

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    Since shot shell must be used after legal shooting hours....where in the world do you think you have to aim a shotgun to allow a 300 yard trajectory? No offense but some of your other safety claims are just as silly.

    Serious question hatsan125sniper, are you a convicted felon?
     
  10. Munson

    Munson 10 pointer

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    Start a poll thread maybe more ppl will weigh in that wouldn't otherwise? I really don't give a crap what weapon anyone hunts with as long as they are accurate with it... sling shots, west Virginia ninje stars lol. The relentless pursuit guy is a straight up killer with a spear & blow gun
     
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  11. louisvillehunter

    louisvillehunter 6 pointer

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    hatsan125sniper, like I said I'm on your side for making it legal. I don't agree with you range argument. It all depends on the trajectory of the projectile. How far is my 308 going to travel if I am 20ft up in my tree stand shooting at a downward angle at an distance of 50 yards? Same thing with the shotgun, people are not shooting them at a bird in the sky. Here is a chart that states some very different numbers. It boils down to knowing your surroundings and being responsible. pellet safe distance.jpg
     
  12. riverboss

    riverboss 12 pointer

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    There is nothing I'm going to learn from you! LOL!
    You must be true rifleman's little brother, your claims of 300 yrd pellets being dangerous compared to your super sniper red Rider are childish.

    So someone killed a coyote at 30 yrds with a pellet gun! How many were shot that ran off?
    Don't tell me it hasn't happend, I've been killing coyotes for over 30 yrs and I've seen them leave after being shot with alot of different guns.
    It's about being ethical and to me ethical is making sure that you have plenty of what you need to do the job needed, not the bare minimum to get it done if everything is perfect.
    Good luck with your quest, but I for one won't support it.
     
  13. Louis as I typed before They get that number from a super light alloy pellet that weights about 7 grains something close to the 5 grain steel bb's used in a shot shell .

    They are very bad to use in the guns because its like dry firing them the piston just slams into the receiver and it can break the piston .

    Watch this video you can see this is the model 350 magnum the one in your photo that has it listed as 1050 fps in 22 cal . The video shows him using a 14.5 pellet which is to light for coyotes it should a 18 grain or in that area which I will go over next . but lets just go with this lighter pellet.
    So you can see with a light weight lead pellet of 14.5 puts the gun that was 1050 fps to a 803.6 feet fps gun . and you will see that the 500 and even 600 yard danger zone is some what ridiculous but its listed that way so younger shooter will know its not a toy and should not be pointed into the air and shot . You can look on chair gun and see it would be impossible for the pellets to go that far let alone be dangerous . It's things like that that are very misleading to people that don't know anything about ballistics . They see that and say wow its like a 22 lr but I hope I'm showing you its not .

    The video shows the crony as the gun having a average of 803.6 . here is a graph using this gun with that pellet used in the video . Its the same thing with all the guns you show . The high fps is a marketing thing because most people thing faster is better but once you get over 950 fps the pellet starts to tumble and its less accurate .

    Download the chairgun program and enter the numbers it gives you all the drop info and fpe at 100 yards the pellet only has 2.29 fpe . that is less that the shotgun steel bb has .

    The shotguns 5 grain steel bb's starts out with 1,300 fps out of the gun and with at that 100 yards distance that bb is still traveling 354.7 fps compared to to the pellet going 266 fps . And remember with the shot gun blast not all the pellets are going to hit the coyote there is always going to be steel bb's from the shotgun going past the target and into the woods so no matter how you look at it the air gun is safer than a shotgun shell blast .

    The whole thing I'm getting at is the main reason a shot gun is used at night is for safety reasons not accuracy . There is no rim fire or center fire single projectile that compares with a shotguns fps of the projectile But now there is the air gun that is even safer than the shotgun and its more accurate and quieter .

    This is what I'm trying to get across to the fish and wildlife people . Once they see the comparison they should allow a air gun to be used at night for coyotes and turkey during the day of course . But right now you can't use a airgun for Turkey or coyotes at night . So I'm trying to get them to change this . If for no other reason because they are safer.
     

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    Last edited: Jul 11, 2018
  14. Munson I don't know what a poll thread is or how to start one . can you help me out ?
     
  15. Munson

    Munson 10 pointer

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    Pick the forum u want it in> post new thread> scroll down to bottom of page

    I would keep the question short.. unlike your post on this thread lol
     
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