Baiting Illegal!

Discussion in 'Deer Hunting' started by maxcam, Aug 25, 2006.

  1. deadaim

    deadaim 12 pointer

    6,726
    134
    Dec 12, 2001
    Booger Hollar
    Kalen

    ''do you really think guys that have plenty of land to hunt are really out to steal your deer and keep you beat down as a hunter? All in the name of baiting.......?'' Kalen, I know you share what you have with others and are looking out for all hunters......It just makes it easy for a guy to be against baiting if he has the land for food plots ect. (not saying thats why you are)...but in southeastern Ky there are plenty of hunters without the land or resorces for food plots that need supplemental feeding to keep deer on there leases and or propertys. Can I hunt without it sure I can...But is it fair that I cant bring deer to my property with a broadcast corn feeder but some other guy with a back forty can bring them on his with 40 acres of biologic? I am for the ban if it does keep disease down in the Turkey ect. I just think that Banning it for that period is just opening the door for a TOTAL BAN and until they can show me proof that it is hurting the deer herd (we now have more deer than ever) im against that.
     
  2. Duster

    Duster 12 pointer

    I am curious to that answer also Deadaim. If the problem is supplemental feeding as some call it then the food plot has to fall into that same catagory as a feeder. If not planted those crops would not exist and we all know thier sole purpose is to attract and hold wildlife be it deer, turkey or what ever. I don't see the non deer hunting farms planting the food plot type crops without planing to harvest them for profit at some tme of the year. Those food plots are IMO supplemental not natural.

    I really see this if it goes past the turkey season end date as the start of a total ban on feeding wildlife on a small scale, but the large operations will be allowed to continue with the food plots. It is IMO would be just one group pushing thier ethics on another on the ways you can hunt deer.

    Just a thought I am going to toss out there on the length of the ban. Why go past turkey season if thats the reason for the ban to start with. I am not sure but maybe the time to get around to all the corn piles spotted from the air and having to work turkey season in a more normal manner ,checking licence, taking tresspassing calls, ect would be lacking so what better time to write those citations than after the season goes out and they have more free time on thier hands to knock on doors.
     
  3. Multidigits

    Multidigits BBBC Members

    17,760
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    Dec 10, 2001
    Vine Grove, Ky, USA.

    Duster, can you search the internet or any other source and find deer with nose to nose contact in a food plot? We all know you can find that in gravity drop feeders and bait piles. Food plots do not promote direct contact that a feeder would. Some contact, but not nearly as much.

    I've planted a lot of stuff over the years and a lot of it will get good use out of it from turkeys (and deer), but none of those plots compare to the draw of corn from a feeder, when they can't get it any other place. Food plots are not baiting by any strech of the imagination.
     
  4. Duster

    Duster 12 pointer

    Bait is bait food plot or not if you put out a crop for the sole purpose of attracting deer and turkeys it is bait IMO and that will not change. Even tho you have a feeder that don't mean the deer or turkeys stand around like feed lot cattle waiting for the grain to be spun out. Watching the deer out back and seeing how they react there is not much nose to nose contact going on here. A few swift kicks a lowered head, ears laid back and the baddest deer claims the feeder the others if not ran off stand away or work the large area edges to those few kernels they can find.

    Everyone seems to think nose to nose contact is a bad thing maybe maybe not IMO and from what I have seen the same thing goes on in natural circumstances on a regular basis. Along with head butts between bucks slobbers running everywhere, kicks between doe's and younger deer, doe's licking fawns thats all contact.

    I keep seeing the CWD scare. What happened in Wisconsin when they attempted to kill off all the deer in the countys where CWD was found. What were the results of the test ran on those deer killed. If I recall a very low number tested positive. I also think that these new found diseases in the past few years such as CWD have been around longer than we have been alive so nothing is new just reinvented.
     
  5. CM12

    CM12 8 pointer

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    Dec 13, 2004
    Knott Co.
    Multi, I'm not reffering to "birdfeeder". I mean I know of people that don't hunt who pour corn/bait out for the sole pupose of watching the turkeys/deer eat it. Now wouldn't this also be illegal?

    As far as deer to deer contact, will we have to start issueing condoms to the bucks, so as to not transmit any toxins? I mean, thats pretty close contact wouldn't you say?
     
  6. CM12

    CM12 8 pointer

    769
    0
    Dec 13, 2004
    Knott Co.

    Why would an archer be using something thats not considered archery equipment??

    I present that if an archer is using it then its archery equipment. Regardless of how someone tries to define it. Common sense always wins out.
     
  7. Multidigits

    Multidigits BBBC Members

    17,760
    1
    Dec 10, 2001
    Vine Grove, Ky, USA.

    When a link is found that diseases are transferred by deer having consensual sex, then steps will likely be taken, probably in the form of drastic herd reductions.
     
  8. aceoky

    aceoky 12 pointer

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    Jul 14, 2003
    W KY
    IIRC it was ONLY .7% of the deer killed/tested were postitive for CWD.....that's seven tenths of ONE PERCENT!

    Anyone remember the AIDS scare? One would find it hard to think that there are this many people left (IV drug use seems to still be a huge problem, homosexuality is it seems at least as much as it was then.....but there are still a bunch of the "high risk" groups functioning, despite what was imagined at the time) ;)

    I still have "mixed feelings" on this, (mainly on the dates ; which honestly from the start "troubled me"), however the Dept. and their biologists surely has their reasons, AND IF there is any real chance of disease/death to our resources from this, I'd say it's in our best interest to consider the "big picture", after doing some research and thinking on this, it's "not the end of the world" ,and again when it comes to the resources *I* would much rather be "safe" than "sorry" .....especially after the fact (of an outbreak that may have been caused by this)....

    I'd rather NOT wait for CWD to be found THEN try to stop it's spread, I'd rather be more cautious and consider what we can do NOW to prevent any more spread then is inevitable......again though, that's "just me", and I'm not saying I'm convinced it would happen, but since many think it "could", it's simply not worth the risk???(same is true with Blue tongue or anything else, the article posted mentioned TB and a few others, it stands to reason (even if not really proven yet) that there could be more risk because of baiting/feeding, though animal to animal contact is the "norm" (otherwise we'd certainly have a deer shortage sooner rather than later):D

    I don't see that food plots will ever be banned (for several reasons, one big one would be too easy to "get around" what IS a food plot):D Many could plant clover and cut it as hay,(during the "right times") thus a legit Ag practice that would "double" as a food plot (for only one example) ;)

    Plus in my area of the state (and farther East), eliminate food plots , and the deer WOULD no doubt suffer in health at the very least! Crop damage would be terrible (including someone's grandma's garden) :eek: And I don't think most believe the risks begin to outweigh the benefits, of properly maintanined food plots....fwiw

    I don't see food plots being a "target" anytime soon, if ever.......UNLESS some real proof of the risks and harm show they are too risky, which I doubt many even think they are??
     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2006
  9. aceoky

    aceoky 12 pointer

    13,423
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    Jul 14, 2003
    W KY
    LMAO, I think Mike was trying to "yank my chain" on that.....but you sir are very correct! :)

    Also note the KDFWR definition of "Arrow" ;)
     
  10. buckfever

    buckfever 12 pointer

    13,203
    77
    Oct 25, 2002
    Harrods Creek Ky, USA.
    Who really cares if crossbows are considered archery? Your supposition, however, that crossbow use is "archery" begs the question.

    Ask 1000 people off the street to draw you a picture of the weapon that is used by "archers". I'd bet that all 1000 people will end up drawing a picture of a regular bow. What does that tell us about "common sense"?
     
  11. aceoky

    aceoky 12 pointer

    13,423
    37
    Jul 14, 2003
    W KY
    Well, for "starters" it tells us it's "easier" for most to draw a picture of a longbow than it is picture of a crossbow!! :D :D :D
     
  12. buckfever

    buckfever 12 pointer

    13,203
    77
    Oct 25, 2002
    Harrods Creek Ky, USA.
    Very true, Ace, very true.

    Back to the original programming. . . .I don't have strong feelings about bait because I'm not sure it poses any significant current threat, but, to the extent that we ever found CWD in the state, I'd immediately become a big-time anti-bait advocate. I thought that article that Old Oak posted earlier in the thread was informative. Does anybody know how prevalent bovine TB is in the state???
     
  13. WBBP

    WBBP 12 pointer

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    Nov 24, 2003
    Deadaim and Duster: You make some good points and I have never really thought about it from the other perspective. I am just stating my personal thoughts on the subject, those thoughts jsut guide how I manage and hunt. I am not on a campaign to outlaw baiting, but I would support its outlawing if asked. I think I am in the minority currently.

    My biggest problem is with a few techniques used in baiting, ie...the continued piling up of corn in the same place year after year, putting out too much corn where it gets molded, etc. Bringing and concentrating the deer to the same place year after year just isn't a good practice IMO.

    I also know that deer have nose to nose and mouth to mouth contact under natural conditions. I personally saw bucks licking each others mouths last year right after one buck had eaten the velvet from another bucks antlers. First time I ever saw that. Several that hunt and have hunted on my farm have used bait to hunt over and to get pictures. Recently, I discussed more sanitary ways to bait with them, so I am strcitly about the health and not passing any judgement on anyone.

    If you think that foodplots and baiting are the same, I will never change your opinion. I think it is all about scale and you are wrong. I will never agree that putting out 4,000 lbs of corn/yr makes much difference to a small of deer herd. IMO, baiting from a feeder accomplishes the mission of bringing the deer to one spot with limited nutrition gains and nothing else. My 20 acres of clover in 10 different areas of the farm brings the deer to a more general location, but provides tons and tons of high quality digestible protein. The corn I raise does the same thing, but provides carbs................this is real nutrition, not a snack........On the other hand, we killed 32 does and 6 bucks last year, so we are controlling the local population. We plan to kill 20 more does this year, hopefully the youth hunt will be a big part of this.

    Looks like we will just agree to disagree. :)
     
  14. LoweBow

    LoweBow 8 pointer

    835
    0
    Jan 10, 2003
    Shelby Co.
    Ballard or Sky.........

    I'm asking this question because I have been told by many that they will fight this legally and I really have no opinion.....

    Is it legal for KDFWR to make it illegal to feed animals out of the hunting season or is this an infringment on the property owners rights?

    I had a guy tell me that he and the County Judge would be becoming very close after the 1st couple dozen tickets are issued. He talked as if he'd be hiring lawyers to contest this.
    What is your legal standing on this if any?
     
  15. deadaim

    deadaim 12 pointer

    6,726
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    Dec 12, 2001
    Booger Hollar
    Kalen, Im not against food plots

    Im just not against baiting either with all the deer we have. I cant see any reason for a baiting ban. I use broadcast feeders that do not pile up the corn. They go off in the morning and at 1pm and at dark there is usually little corn left on the ground....perhaps some education on how to bait to avoid spoiling and disease is in order but I dont see why the ban maybe im just looking at it all wrong...I guess its not going to affect me too much as I was only able to harvest one lousey doe on my property last year I wish they congregated around the feeders at my place.......
     

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