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Discussion in 'Deer Hunting' started by jjones, Jul 20, 2012.
deductions smuctions...if they grow it, it counts
I have two farms I can hunt here in Kentucky, I can hunt on a 40,000 acre Military Base and several farms in Indiana this Season also.
I hope I get another chance at another great Buck.
being called new jr. isn't an insult. it just means your a winner. and winners win debates on ky hunting forum.
funny thing is B&C wrote the book on scoring whitetails and every other big game animall in NA, it is their system and many other organizations had to acquire permission from them to even use the system. Their system was written over 100 years ago to reward a deer based on mass, tine length, width and symmetry. How many of you would be bragging if your girlfriend or wife had 2 ears on one side? How about one round eye and a slanted eye? How about a an a cup on the right and a dd on the left? What if she had an extra hand growing off her left arm? I don't think the point can get any clearer than that. Say what you want, but what hunters do is take a proprietry scoring system, manipulate it so they can brag about a bigger number. You can't claim your deer is 160" when it isnt based on a standard system. B&C established the standards. A deer scored according to those standards has to suffer the deductions if they are present. Buckmasters has tried for 30 years to create a hunter friendly braggard system. How many times do you see it referred to oputside of their magazine? Rarely if ever! Only when some guy thinks hes been slighted by B&C cause his buck broke a point... Why should "I" be penalized.... He has a sticker and it kept me from making book... Mine is bigger than yours... It's all a bunch of BS. If it's measured using B&C standards then there are deductions. It isnt being penalized, it's just the standards. Does a guy get to record a run in baseball if he doesn't touch second base? Does the three eared chick get asked to the prom?
BTW, I'm just as guilty as the next guy. My Ohio buck grosses 174, I don't even know the net, it's in the 150's. I'm an official scorer and having it entered has not been a priority of mine. When someone asks me what it scores I say 174 gross, 150 something net. I like the big number, it's human nature. Even B&C has bowed to this and has started listing the gross scores of deer that net high enough to be entered. Fact of the matter is, I'm not going to criticize the organization that created the system and were also quite helpful with conserving and restoring our wildlife during a period of time that people had over harvested them nearly to extinction.
FYI, the B&C system was originally created because our big game animals were nearly extinct. It was a system to record historical data for future generations that may not ever get to see a living whitetail, elk, black bear... not so hunters could brag about how big their animal was.
I'm sure he'll be here any minute to support you Bill....
I agree with you Bill. IMO, a higher net score does not always means a "better" buck. I'm always amazed when I go to shows and see high-scoring bucks that are simply less impressive and frankly inferior (at least IMO) to bucks that net lower because of deductions. Don't get me wrong, every deer that has 160" of antlers is a great buck and the scoring system is about the best we've got, but I've seen lots of unbelievable looking 150-class bucks that look like they'd absolutely dominate over a few of the bucks that happened to have a little better symmetry.
Although I disagree with your personal assessment that you shot a "B&C" buck (for the reasons pointed out by others), I will confirm that your buck is precisely one of those deer that I'd much rather kill than many spindly, long-tined 10 ptrs that happened to exceed the net 160" score.
How's that for being a nice guy? Just call me, Mr. Nice Guy Good Deed Doer.
Also, if you'll scroll back a few pages, I think you'll also find that I was also very nice when I disagreed with the folks that opined that Bill was the anti-Christ.
If you read through Revelations, it's pretty clear that the anti-Christ doesn't fish with an umbrella rig.
Bill, I don't know you from Jobe but a line from the movie Animal House came to mind when I read this post.
This thread has got my head spinning, it made sense for a bit then something about Bill being the antichrist , killing a booner that wasn't or someother BS.
Deer season can't come quick enough.
"How many of you would be bragging if your girlfriend or wife had 2 ears on one side? How about one round eye and a slanted eye? How about a an a cup on the right and a dd on the left? What if she had an extra hand growing off her left arm? I don't think the point can get any clearer than that."
The next time I try to explain the symmetry requirements of the B&C scoring system to another deer hunter, SD's metaphor about the female gender will rumble through my brain like a freight train out of control. Best post of the thread in my book!
I think the next world record could come from KY and I am willing to take one for the team here in the commonwealth and put the big one on the ground!
I think proportion wise, as many trophy bucks go unentered and unmeasured in KY as any other state. Truth be told, a high percentage of them probably aren't exactly "eligible" either... Yes, I'm saying it, there are poachers that shoot big deer, and for some because they are a felon or convicted game law violator, simply aren't eligible..
Symmetry is important in measuring antlers, by Bill's logic a buck that has 20 points on one side (measuring 140") and a 20 inch spike on the other should make B&C... Even NT racks are measured and deductions taken on the net typical frame, and cactus bucks are not eligible, nor are antlered does.
Now Realtree is talking about the good Deer Hunting here in Kentucky.
that sure is a good deer from nicholas county..dont think I've seen that 1 yet
BF is this pro bono or are you on payroll?
Bucks from High fence ranches and Velvet Bucks can not be entered into the B&C Records.
There are probably hundreds of Bucks taken across North America every year on High Fence Ranches that are never entered into the records.
There have been velvet Bucks here in Kentucky that score over 180 inches, actually a few years ago a Velvet Buck was taken here in Kentucky that scored 293 inches, but it was never entered into the B&C Records.
Also, people always talk about Illinois, Iowa, and Kansas, but what about Canada ? I bet there are hundreds of B&C Bucks that simply die of old age every year in Canada. Canada probably has more B&C Bucks than Illinois, Kentucky, Iowa, and Kansas combined. Most of those Bucks in Canada probably just die of old age.