Ginsburg: I thought Roe vs Wade was to rid undesirables

[Colorado_Hunter]

In an astonishing admission, U.S. Supreme Court Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg says she was under the impression that legalizing abortion with the 1973 Roe. v. Wade case would eliminate undesirable members of the populace, or as she put it "populations that we don't want to have too many of."

Who exactly are the "undesirables" she was talking about?

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/qq67/colorado_hunter/PassthePopcorn.gif

[turkeytalker]

In an astonishing admission, U.S. Supreme Court Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg says she was under the impression that legalizing abortion with the 1973 Roe. v. Wade case would eliminate undesirable members of the populace, or as she put it "populations that we don't want to have too many of."

Who exactly are the "undesirables" she was talking about?

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/qq67/colorado_hunter/PassthePopcorn.gif


Do you have a link?

[Colorado_Hunter]

Do you have a link?

Her remarks, set to be published in the New York Times Magazine this Sunday but viewable online now (http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/12/magazine/12ginsburg-t.html?pagewanted=print), came in an in-depth interview with Emily Bazelon titled, "The Place of Women on the Court."

[buckfever]

I

Who exactly are the "undesirables" she was talking about?



What do you mean, who are the "undesirables"? They are the fetuses whose parents don't want them.
A "woman's right to privacy"?? My ass. No such thing in the Constitution.

It's a legal fiction made up by a liberal Supreme Court to make the American public feel better about legalizing a method to get rid of unwanted, unborn children without having to call it murder.

At least it sounds like Ginsberg is admitting that culling off infants in the so-called "best interest of society" was really the true driver behind Roe v. Wade.

[B.M. Barrelcooker]

Dang............I have always been one of them "undesireables".........I guess I got missed by the scapple early on and have kept bouncing along by happenstance ever since.

It ain't been too bad of a ride except maybe some of them dirty looks I get every now and then.

[westkybanded]

BM, it's a coathanger, not a scappel.

And the thing that saved you and me both was Joan Crawford scaring our moms into not allowing wire coathangers in the house.

[Art]

Abortion is not a hot button issue with me. I can't waste my time worrying about what others choose to do with their bodies and unborn children. Sure, I'd like it if we didn't have a need for abortions, but I think the only way we get to that point is to mandate birth control and socialized medicines. That is scary, but what other way is there to truly stop unwanted pregnancies? Is it worth that?

As it stands, society provides no real benefit for women to NOT get pregnant accidentally or on purpose under terrible circumstances. We do however reward women who have unwanted children in the form of welfare, tax breaks, and a whole array of free services that are not available to responsible women. We make it easy.

I don't know what side you are personally on concerning this issue, but if you could hear what my wife sees on a daily basis at her work dealing with teen mothers, your outlook on society WOULD change for the worse. It liken it to spaying, neutering, and euthanizing pets. At what point is it ok to end a single life or to end the ability to procreate if it saves countless lives down the road?

[elkguy]

Abortion is not a hot button issue with me. I can't waste my time worrying about what others choose to do with their bodies and unborn children. Sure, I'd like it if we didn't have a need for abortions, but I think the only way we get to that point is to mandate birth control and socialized medicines. That is scary, but what other way is there to truly stop unwanted pregnancies? Is it worth that?

As it stands, society provides no real benefit for women to NOT get pregnant accidentally or on purpose under terrible circumstances. We do however reward women who have unwanted children in the form of welfare, tax breaks, and a whole array of free services that are not available to responsible women. We make it easy.

I don't know what side you are personally on concerning this issue, but if you could hear what my wife sees on a daily basis at her work dealing with teen mothers, your outlook on society WOULD change for the worse. It liken it to spaying, neutering, and euthanizing pets. At what point is it ok to end a single life or to end the ability to procreate if it saves countless lives down the road?


So, we need to selectively abort, sterilize, and euthanize undesirables to benefit the whole of society? I think Hitler was trying that. But, I guess its OK if you are the one doing the picking.

There is one guaranteed way to avoid unwanted pregnancies. Stop having sex. If one gets pregnant, guess what? There are consequences.

But yes, our welfare, nanny state does subsidize the lowest common demoninators.

And it is not the woman's body that concerns me. It is the baby.

[Art]

That's not what I'm suggesting, elkguy. All I'm saying is that is the only way to stop people from having children when they don't need them. Simply telling people not to have sex has never worked and never will.

[grouser68]

Q: Are you talking about the distances women have to travel because in parts of the country, abortion is essentially unavailable, because there are so few doctors and clinics that do the procedure? And also, the lack of Medicaid (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/news/health/diseasesconditionsandhealthtopics/medicaid/index.html?inline=nyt-classifier) for abortions for poor women?

JUSTICE GINSBURG: Yes, the ruling about that surprised me. [Harris v. McRae — in 1980 the court upheld the Hyde Amendment, which forbids the use of Medicaid for abortions.] Frankly I had thought that at the time Roe was decided, there was concern about population growth and particularly growth in populations that we don’t want to have too many of. So that Roe was going to be then set up for Medicaid funding for abortion. Which some people felt would risk coercing women into having abortions when they didn’t really want them. But when the court decided McRae, the case came out the other way. And then I realized that my perception of it had been altogether wrong.

[westkybanded]

??? This thread will be locked down soon enough, but I sure don't want the government telling me what I can and can't do with my body.

[wprebeck]

Neat trick, that.

That is, convincing yourself and others that abortion has something to do with YOUR body. Last I checked, the object being removed was the body of someone else. But hey, try an justify it however you want. I'd think that someone in the medical profession (you ARE a nurse, right?) would view things differently.

But, there's an easy way to avoid the possibilty you may "need" an abortion. Don't have sex. It's that simple.

If, as a woman, you want to control what goeson with your body, please do. See, you have complete control over whether or not a guy sticks one in ya. If you allow it, then you're accepting the potential consequences of WHATEVER may happen. That can include such wonderful things as genital warts, herpes, syphillis, AIDS, hepitatis, and pregnancy. Any or all of these things can happen with sexual intercourse.

If you want to avoid issues like this, don't have sex. Seems pretty simple to me.

Oh, and don't give me that crap about pregnancies that occur as the result of rape. If someone wants to claim abortion is used for this, please provide the hard numbers of abortions that were performed for this specific reason. Then, provide the numbers of abortions that were performed because someone didn't want to have a kid after having casual sex.

While I've not looked at the figures, I'd bet the number of abortions due to rape is somewhere in the <1% portion. Abortion is used primarily as a means of birth control for irresponsible people. It's used as a tool of the left to give the illusion that one can have casual sex without any responsibility attached to it. Morals regarding sex aside, taking responsibility for one's actions should be a given. Instead, people screw each other, and think that there won't be any consequences for it.

Dumbasses, to quote my favorite TV dad.


There's no sense in killing children just because you don't want one. I had this argument with my sister, who spent way too long in college...it turned her liberal, and that's a far cry from the way she was raised. Anyway, she said it's a woman's choice (abortion, that is). Since she was at my house, playing with my kids (her 4 nieces and nephews), I asked her one question -

"Were these kids simply choices my wife could have disposed of?"


Of course, "that's different" (her reply), since that was something that would have affected her personally. She loves my kids, and recoiled from the very thought that they could have been aborted on the whim of my wife. Doesn't stop her from thinking abortion is OK, but that's typical liberal thinking for you.

Anyway, I digress...I'm all for people maintaining control over their own bodies as well. Don't want a kid, keep the man parts that create the kid out of you. Pretty simple, really. No reason to kill a child, because you're the irresponsible piece of crap.

[westkybanded]

Neat trick, that.

That is, convincing yourself and others that abortion has something to do with YOUR body. Last I checked, the object being removed was the body of someone else. But hey, try an justify it however you want. I'd think that someone in the medical profession (you ARE a nurse, right?) would view things differently..

Shoot... I WISH I was a nurse. They make good money!

[grouseguy]

Q: Are you talking about the distances women have to travel because in parts of the country, abortion is essentially unavailable, because there are so few doctors and clinics that do the procedure? And also, the lack of Medicaid (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/news/health/diseasesconditionsandhealthtopics/medicaid/index.html?inline=nyt-classifier) for abortions for poor women?

JUSTICE GINSBURG: Yes, the ruling about that surprised me. [Harris v. McRae — in 1980 the court upheld the Hyde Amendment, which forbids the use of Medicaid for abortions.] Frankly I had thought that at the time Roe was decided, there was concern about population growth and particularly growth in populations that we don’t want to have too many of. So that Roe was going to be then set up for Medicaid funding for abortion. Which some people felt would risk coercing women into having abortions when they didn’t really want them. But when the court decided McRae, the case came out the other way. And then I realized that my perception of it had been altogether wrong.



There you go again, grouser ... messing up a perfectly good right wing rant with "context"!!! :eek:;)

[wprebeck]

Shoot... I WISH I was a nurse. They make good money!

Yes, they do...even the LPN's I know at work make pretty good money, all things considered.

[westkybanded]

Yes, they do...even the LPN's I know at work make pretty good money, all things considered.

I couldn't do it. I'd spend more time on the floor passed out than on my feet. I don't do blood and needles well at ALL!

[mgpatty]

Neat trick, that.

That is, convincing yourself and others that abortion has something to do with YOUR body. ....

...I'm all for people maintaining control over their own bodies as well. Don't want a kid, keep the man parts that create the kid out of you. Pretty simple, really. No reason to kill a child, because you're the irresponsible piece of crap.


The logic in this is profound. Unfortunately logic is something most liberals have a hard time grasping. It's easier to blame someone else (everyone else) and make someone else pay (the child) for your irresponsiblity. This seems to be one of the current philosophical principles of the Democratic party.

[HillBillyFiveO]

Neat trick, that.

Oh, and don't give me that crap about pregnancies that occur as the result of rape.
While I've not looked at the figures, I'd bet the number of abortions due to rape is somewhere in the <1% portion.


Just a question, since this is your position. Even if it is <1%, are you in favor of telling a rape victim that they have to carry the fetus, full term, give birth to it, and then do whatever with it at that point? Or do you support abortion in these cases? Since you brought it up, I'm just trying to clarify your position. I'm not challenging your beliefs.

Floyd T.

[Willie]

"Ginsburg"?

Is that Jewish name?

Didn't Hitler try to "get rid of the undesirables too"?

[Willie]

99% of ALL abortions are a matter of convience................

[Hammer]

abortion used to be a hot topic with me, but it isn't anymore. I don't agree with it, and I think it is wrong. However, I see absolutely no good end to arguing with a pro-choicer over it. I've never had a productive conversation in that area.

It's not against the law, and people are going to do it. I'm not really apathetic about it, but I have learned there's really nothing I can do about it. I'd rather concentrate on things I can make an impact on.

[skin_dog1]

There are some folks on here who's opinions absolutely scare the he'll
out of me. I am so glad those opinions r still in the minority

[westkybanded]

There are some folks on here who's opinions absolutely scare the he'll
out of me. I am so glad those opinions r still in the minority

Like who? Me?

[PhilpotHunter]

Like who? Me?

you scare me:(

[westkybanded]

you scare me:(

Loosen up your nose clip Sally.

You go by Whittakers and get a lock box? A buddy of mine was in there the other day and said they had several in the back room by the muzzleloaders.

[yote hunter]

abortion used to be a hot topic with me, but it isn't anymore. I don't agree with it, and I think it is wrong. However, I see absolutely no good end to arguing with a pro-choicer over it. I've never had a productive conversation in that area.

It's not against the law, and people are going to do it. I'm not really apathetic about it, but I have learned there's really nothing I can do about it. I'd rather concentrate on things I can make an impact on.
killing Jews in 1940's germany perfectly legal. i quess that most germans didnt agree with it either but hey it was legal.

[raktrakr]

There you go again, grouser ... messing up a perfectly good right wing rant with "context"!!! :eek:;)About like messing up a perfectly good left wing rant with facts:p

[cornbread]

I don't understand how anyone can think that killing a baby is ok. By the way calling it a fetus just to make yourself feel better about killing it donesn't change the fact that it is still a Baby with a heart beat. I think that all the low lives that keep producing children for welfare should be rounded up and forced to work in hard labor camps. No more being a leach to society.

[Haves]

You all should read Freakonomics. It gives an interesting statisical view of what happens when "undesirable" babies are born and the effect on crime 17 years later.

[cornbread]

You all should read Freakonomics. It gives an interesting statisical view of what happens when "undesirable" babies are born and the effect on crime 17 years later.


So who decides who is undesirable? Should a young single women have an abortion because she is worthless. If that is the case then Obama should have been aborted.

[Haves]

So who decides who is undesirable? Should a young single women have an abortion because she is worthless. If that is the case then Obama should have been aborted.


I would erase the word "should" have and substitute "could" have. It's the mothers body, it's her choice.

Go adopt a black child if you want every child on earth. Their are plenty without fathers or in foster care. Their could be millions more if you outlaw abortion.

[skin_dog1]

You all should read Freakonomics. It gives an interesting statisical view of what happens when "undesirable" babies are born and the effect on crime 17 years later.
ya know, I was one of those undesirable babies that grew up on welfare and a leach to society. I was intelligent enough to know that the way I was brought up was wrong, made a decision to do different and be better. I don't think I've done much to increase the crime rate other than speeding. I did however spend 6 years as a cop trying to do right. Maybe mom shoulda just done away with me. I'm sure she had plenty of opportunities to in the 70's as a teenage mother.

I get pissed every time I read a post on this subject so I think I'll just stop reading this one.

[turkeytalker]

Go adopt a black child if you want every child on earth. Their are plenty without fathers or in foster care. Their could be millions more if you outlaw abortion.


I'm pretty sure the working class on this forum already haves.

[Haves]

look, it may actually be helping your party.

"More than 40 million legal abortions have occurred in the United States since 1973, and these are not randomly distributed across the population. Black women, for example, have a higher abortion ratio (percentage of pregnancies aborted) than Hispanic women, whose abortion ratio in turn is higher than that of non-Hispanic whites. Since blacks vote Democratic in far greater proportions than Hispanics, and whites are more Republican than Hispanics or blacks, ethnic disparities in abortion ratios would be sufficient to give the GOP a significant boost--surely enough to account for George W. Bush's razor-thin Florida victory in 2000."

[turkeytalker]

49,551,703

undesirables murdered in this country since 1973. Haves the republican party don't want to win by Sherman's techniques, just to shed light on some dim individuals.

[Haves]

40 million born to households who couldn't support them, and single mothers that didn't want them. Turkeytlaker...I may see a little Dem in you yet, wanting that many more on the public dole.:)

[turkeytalker]

40 million born to households who couldn't support them, and single mothers that didn't want them. Turkeytlaker...I may see a little Dem in you yet, wanting that many more on the public dole.:)


Hevas you should see a little Democrat in me, been a constant struggle my entire life between branches of my family tree.

Luckily i understand how the republican party could employ those 40+ million instead of feeding them.

Hsave, ever heard the one about teaching a man how to fish?:rolleyes:

[Hammer]

killing Jews in 1940's germany perfectly legal. i quess that most germans didnt agree with it either but hey it was legal.


Oh brother... :rolleyes: See, when the majority of pro-choicers are pinheads like you, that's why I don't bother to argue! :rolleyes:

[Ky'sFinest]

what can you do? i wouldn't want any female close to me to do it but if some babies momma in the ghetto smokin crack wants to who am i to say anything?


i agree with whoever said that welfare ought to be earned. i always said get them out there helping build roads or cleaning up the place. make them be our garbage people and sidewalk scrapers. earn your keep slackers!

[PhilpotHunter]

Loosen up your nose clip Sally.

You go by Whittakers and get a lock box? A buddy of mine was in there the other day and said they had several in the back room by the muzzleloaders.

I'm taking the concealed carry class this weekend out there so I will pick one up then. Thanks for the heads up.

By the way, did you ever actually catch a fish?

[westkybanded]

I'm taking the concealed carry class this weekend out there so I will pick one up then. Thanks for the heads up.

By the way, did you ever actually catch a fish?

Yup. Several!! :D

[semperhunting]

Neat trick, that.



So what do you do if a woman is actually raped? You never did answer hillbillyfive0's question. I'm against abortion, but sometimes there are circumstances that could possibly rate one IMO.

[Ky'sFinest]

So what do you do if a woman is actually raped? You never did answer hillbillyfive0's question. I'm against abortion, but sometimes there are circumstances that could possibly rate one IMO.


abortions caused by rape according to TIME magazine:

http://www.christianliferesources.com/?/news/view.php&newsid=6233

"Fewer than one half of one percent cited sexual abuse resulting from rape or incest."That is very few. approx 1.5 million nationwide or less.

[HillBillyFiveO]

abortions caused by rape according to TIME magazine:
That is very few. approx 1.5 million nationwide or less.

If one of the 1.5 million was your wife, daughter, sister, mom, etc, would you demand they carry to full term and then put it up for adoption?! Keep it?!

In the big picture, I guess 1.5 million is a "small" number. Tell those 1.5 million women they have to continue to be victimized because some people don't support abortion. Absolutely not right! Period!

Floyd T.

[semperhunting]

I don't care if it's 1.5 million or only 1. I want to know what happens then.

[HillBillyFiveO]

I don't care if it's 1.5 million or only 1. I want to know what happens then.

What he said! :confused:

Floyd T.

[turkeytalker]

If one of the 1.5 million was your wife, daughter, sister, mom, etc, would you demand they carry to full term and then put it up for adoption?! Keep it?!



Thats easy, "It's hard to demand anything from the pen".

[turkeytalker]

I don't care if it's 1.5 million or only 1. I want to know what happens then.


So you are saying kill the little undesirables?

[HillBillyFiveO]

Answer the question, don't respond with another question.

If it were your family, that was a rape victim, and they were found to be pregnant with the rapists child, what would you do? Would you favor an abortion by said family member? Would you encourage it?

The "...from the pen..." response, is that because you'd kill the rapist? If so, you still haven't answered the question in that post either.

Floyd T.

[yote hunter]

Answer the question, don't respond with another question.

If it were your family, that was a rape victim, and they were found to be pregnant with the rapists child, what would you do? Would you favor an abortion by said family member? Would you encourage it?

The "...from the pen..." response, is that because you'd kill the rapist? If so, you still haven't answered the question in that post either.

Floyd T.
if my daughter was raped and got pregnant by the rapist i would not be in favor of murdering my grandchild .its not the babies fault its mother was raped.i am in favor of murdering the rapist.
read this.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baby_scoop_era

[turkeytalker]

if my daughter was raped and got pregnant by the rapist i would not be in favor of murdering my grandchild .its not the babies fault its mother was raped.i am in favor of murdering the rapist.
read this.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baby_scoop_era



" In contrast, the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services estimates that only 14,000 infants were "voluntarily" surrendered in 2003.[5] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baby_scoop_era#cite_note-4)."

Guess babies is a pretty high commodity for some lately. I'm still against killing them though, otherwise i'd move to China and be with my other commie buddies

[CanisMajor]

The truth about Planned Parenthood and its founder:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kEja-1emRic

To liberals, pre-born babies are "human weeds" that may be (should be) disposed of without thought.

[PhilpotHunter]

You all should read Freakonomics. It gives an interesting statisical view of what happens when "undesirable" babies are born and the effect on crime 17 years later.

I did read that book, and the author had a heck of a way of making you think outside of the box didn't he?

But really, are you so selfish that you would allow 49 million deaths of human life just for a lower crime rate? To me that means you are one of the "undesirables" you speak of, being as how you are ok with murder and all. Me, I'll try a different route, one that doesn't involve murder.

And for anyone that disagrees with me on this one, well, THANK GOD YOUR MOTHER DIDN'T, or you wouldn't be sitting comfortable behind your computer now would you?

[HillBillyFiveO]

if my daughter was raped and got pregnant by the rapist i would not be in favor of murdering my grandchild .its not the babies fault its mother was raped.i am in favor of murdering the rapist.
read this.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baby_scoop_era

Fair enough. So you would be willing to demand that your daughter carry the spawn of the rapist, to full term, give birth to it and raise it as it were her own, or put it up for adoption!? So, every day of her life, she can look at this child and rehash the rape!? If you had your way, and outlawed abortions, you'd be fine with allowing your daughter to suffer, for at least nine months, if not for the rest of her life, because of "your" beliefs?!

Interesting how you have no problem supporting legislation telling your daughter what she can and can't do with her body. You'd allow someone (ie: the gov't) to make your daughter suffer after one of the most heinous crimes against a woman, and not have any issues with it. Interesting!

Again, your beliefs are your beliefs. It just amazes what some people will say they would do to a rapist (kill) but because it's a fetus (soon to be an infant, if born), it's a completely different story. I do appreciate your honesty in answering.

Floyd T.

[duckslayer870]

I have given it alot of thought over the years. My mother was pregnant with me in high school she married my dad and have been together since 1979 happily I might add. I guess she could have done away with me because according to this I am undesirable. A product of a teenage pregnancy. I have never commited a crime other than a speeding ticket. I have one BS degree and am working on another. I am happily married with one child of my own and consider myself normal except for the insane desire to hunt ducks. So if I am undesirable so be it.

[Art]

I don't think the age of the mother is an accurate gauge of whether or not the baby is "undesirable". I have known teenage girls that got pregnant, but you knew the mother and child would be alright, because they were good kids raised by good parents. It was an honest mistake, bad judgement, or what have you but they have already been taught to make the best of yourself and your situation.

On the other hand, I have seen teenage mothers that you just knew would never make anything of themselves, and they came from parents who were the same way. That's not to say their kid won't grow up to rule the world, but the odds are overwhelmingly against that. Chances are that the child will just extenuate the already dire circumstances.

[yote hunter]

Fair enough. So you would be willing to demand that your daughter carry the spawn of the rapist, to full term, give birth to it and raise it as it were her own, or put it up for adoption!? So, every day of her life, she can look at this child and rehash the rape!? If you had your way, and outlawed abortions, you'd be fine with allowing your daughter to suffer, for at least nine months, if not for the rest of her life, because of "your" beliefs?!

Interesting how you have no problem supporting legislation telling your daughter what she can and can't do with her body. You'd allow someone (ie: the gov't) to make your daughter suffer after one of the most heinous crimes against a woman, and not have any issues with it. Interesting!

Again, your beliefs are your beliefs. It just amazes what some people will say they would do to a rapist (kill) but because it's a fetus (soon to be an infant, if born), it's a completely different story. I do appreciate your honesty in answering.

Floyd T.
i personaly know 2 women who have had abortions and both terribly regrete it and it tears them up daily.the "fetus" is alive and if you did test on it you would determind that it is human and therefor human life and an abortion kills it i.e. murder.the rapist is a savage crimanal deserving to die for his crimes.the baby is innocent of anything.
can you tell me 100% positively when life begins?how is it that we give a 1st degree murderer a trial where he can get off on a "reasonable dought but no one can say when life begins but we dont give a baby reasonable dought.

[2speed]

I have to get in on this one, who ever is for abortion and or ever voted for the people that are for it will all burn in hell someday....

[HillBillyFiveO]

I have to get in on this one, who ever is for abortion and or ever voted for the people that are for it will all burn in hell someday....

Thanks you, GOD, for assessing my destiny! I hadn't realized the "2nd Coming" had occurred and Christ chose Southeast Kentucky to come back to. :rolleyes:

Floyd T.

[HillBillyFiveO]

i personaly know 2 women who have had abortions and both terribly regrete it and it tears them up daily.the "fetus" is alive and if you did test on it you would determind that it is human and therefor human life and an abortion kills it i.e. murder.the rapist is a savage crimanal deserving to die for his crimes.the baby is innocent of anything.
can you tell me 100% positively when life begins?how is it that we give a 1st degree murderer a trial where he can get off on a "reasonable dought but no one can say when life begins but we dont give a baby reasonable dought.

Yote, you failed to answer my question! Reread the 1st paragraph and provide your answer, please.

Floyd T.

[yote hunter]

Yote, you failed to answer my question! Reread the 1st paragraph and provide your answer, please.

Floyd T.
of course i would demand it.i would rather my daughter go through 9 months of hell than 50 or 60 yrs of hell that one is simple.do some reaserch on the mental health of women in thier 30's and 40's who have had abortions.

[HillBillyFiveO]

of course i would demand it.i would rather my daughter go through 9 months of hell than 50 or 60 yrs of hell that one is simple.do some reaserch on the mental health of women in thier 30's and 40's who have had abortions.

Once again, I appreciate your honesty. I don't need to d the research because it will not change my opinion on abortion. I'd venture to guess there are the vocal "regretters", who now champion Pro-Life movements as well as the people who've accepted the decision and still support Pro-Choice. The fact a portion of the women who've gotten abortions, regret them, doesn't sell the argument either way.

If you have a daughter, may she live a very long and happy life. Any inference to your family was purely hypothetical. No ill will ever intended. :)

Floyd T.

PS: As for your previous post, the definition of "life" and when it begins is as debatable as what "is" is! There is the Biblical interpretation as well as scientific interpretations. Not goin there!

[TripleGee]

[QUOTE=HillBillyFiveO;780835]Fair enough.* So you would be willing to demand that your daughter carry the spawn of the rapist, to full term, give birth to it and raise it as it were her own, or put it up for adoption!?* So, every day of her life, she can look at this child and rehash the rape!?* If you had your way, and outlawed abortions, you'd be fine with allowing your daughter to suffer, for at least nine months, if not for the rest of her life, because of "your" beliefs?!* Interesting how you have no problem supporting legislation telling your daughter what she can and can't do with her body.* You'd* allow someone (ie: the gov't) to make your daughter suffer after one of the most heinous crimes against a woman, and not have any issues with it.* Interesting!Again, your beliefs are your beliefs.* It just amazes what some people will say they would do to a rapist (kill) but because it's a fetus (soon to be an infant, if born), it's a completely different story.* I do appreciate your honesty in answering.]

In regards to the "killing the rapist versus the unborn child conflict" you mentioned.* Rapists have got it much too easy these days, even if they're convicted.* Back in the Bible, one incident involved a young man from one tribe or clan admiring a daughter of another so much that he raped her and brought shame on her and the family.* Two of her brothers wanted his blood but, the dude's dad pleaded for terms to which the crime would be satisfied.* So the Patricarch of the family said that all the men in the other family had to be cicumcised and follow God and then they would allow the dude to marry the offended daughter.* So, they all agreed to be circumcised and while they were weak from the procedure, the brothers slaughtered everyone in the family.* I'm not sure, but, I think that it was Jacob's sons who did the killing.* Some lineage of Abraham anyway.So, applying that today, if someone rapes another, then their entire family should be put to death!* Think that would stop most rapes???Of course today in some middle eastern countries, if a woman is raped, SHE is killed because SHE brought shame on her family by being Raped!!!!* No wonder their religion is crap!!!

[TripleGee]

ya know, I was one of those undesirable babies that grew up on welfare and a leach to society. I was intelligent enough to know that the way I was brought up was wrong, made a decision to do different and be better. I don't think I've done much to increase the crime rate other than speeding. I did however spend 6 years as a cop trying to do right. Maybe mom shoulda just done away with me. I'm sure she had plenty of opportunities to in the 70's as a teenage mother.*I get pissed every time I read a post on this subject so I think I'll just stop reading this one.Skin Dog 1,I for one am glad that you are in the world today!:)* I was raised by my daddy to be racist white trash.* I'm glad mom decided to divorce his butt even though it warped my mind for life.* It took years for me to undo what he did.* Actually, God did it by teaching me many things.* For instance, one day he revealed to me that no black man had ever once said or did anything harmful to me, just white folks!* I really lightened up after that and actually got to appreciating black culture and wanting to learn what I could from several guys that I played ball with.* There are actually several that I'd have no problem at all with them marrying my sister.* J.D., Dennis B., and Elgin P.* are all three awesome guys who were raised right in regards to how to treat their fellow man and such and such.* White folks can learn a lot from black folks in regards to family and such.* I hope this ain't too racist for anyone.* It's not intended to be.* *

[buckfever]

Back in the Bible, one incident involved a young man from one tribe or clan admiring a daughter of another so much that he raped her and brought shame on her and the family.* Two of her brothers wanted his blood but, the dude's dad pleaded for terms to which the crime would be satisfied.* So the Patricarch of the family said that all the men in the other family had to be cicumcised and follow God and then they would allow the dude to marry the offended daughter.* So, they all agreed to be circumcised and while they were weak from the procedure, the brothers slaughtered everyone in the family.* I'm not sure, but, I think that it was Jacob's sons who did the killing.* Some lineage of Abraham anyway.So, applying that today, if someone rapes another, then their entire family should be put to death!*

Hmmm. . . . Interesting. :rolleyes:

Another "Let me get this straight" story about the rapist who had 10 big, strong sword-wielding brothers and the scrawny family of the victim. . .

I guess the moral of this story is that "Thou shalt not rape" or you and ALL your innocent relatives will be put to death. And don't think that just because you're only an innocent uncle that's really a second cousin twice-removed from the rapist or even if you submit to God, you'll be able to avoid the just punishment of death.

Even if you foolishly attempt to atone for your sins by agreeing to pay homage to God, we'll fix your little red wagon anyway in a very clever, duplicitous and vengeful way!!! ;)

The only thing I can take away from this story is that if my brother ever rapes some chick, I'm changing my name and moving to Chile. :p

I can't wait for Art to chime in on this one. :eek:

[Art]

I can't wait for Art to chime in on this one. :eek:


Sometimes, things just speak for themselves. Anything I could say would just take away from the already obvious.:D

[itallushrt]

of course i would demand it.

Do you demand everything else she does in her life as well? :confused:

[120+]

99% of ALL abortions are a matter of convience................

So are 99% of all conceptions. :D

[semperhunting]

So you are saying kill the little undesirables?

If it is the desire of the victim then yes.

Let me be PERFECTLY CLEAR that I support abortion in ONLY the extremist of circumstances. Never have I looked at a person and thought "their momma should have aborted them."

I DO NOT agree with abortions that were simply a result of two people that did not use protection in a moment of passion.

I would have responded sooner but I've been out of town.

[TripleGee]

Hmmm. . . . Interesting. :rolleyes:

Another "Let me get this straight" story about the rapist who had 10 big, strong sword-wielding brothers and the scrawny family of the victim. . .

I guess the moral of this story is that "Thou shalt not rape" or you and ALL your innocent relatives will be put to death. And don't think that just because you're only an innocent uncle that's really a second cousin twice-removed from the rapist or even if you submit to God, you'll be able to avoid the just punishment of death.

Even if you foolishly attempt to atone for your sins by agreeing to pay homage to God, we'll fix your little red wagon anyway in a very clever, duplicitous and vengeful way!!! ;)

The only thing I can take away from this story is that if my brother ever rapes some chick, I'm changing my name and moving to Chile. :p

I can't wait for Art to chime in on this one. :eek:



From your response I gather that you may be thinking that I support killing the entire family??? Not on your life, I was simply sharing a story from the Bible about a rape situation. No weird string of thought or anything like that, just a story.

[TripleGee]

[QUOTE=HillBillyFiveO;781547]Once again, I appreciate your honesty. I don't need to d the research because it will not change my opinion on abortion. I'd venture to guess there are the vocal "regretters", who now champion Pro-Life movements as well as the people who've accepted the decision and still support Pro-Choice. The fact a portion of the women who've gotten abortions, regret them, doesn't sell the argument either way.

If you have a daughter, may she live a very long and happy life. Any inference to your family was purely hypothetical. No ill will ever intended. :)

Floyd T.

Even the lady responsible for Roe vs. Wade, a McCleary(?) lady I think, has joined the movement to overturn that which she was a part of.;)