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N2MyWake
05-18-2004, 07:48 AM
What's the biggest copperhead you guys have seen? I thought they only got to be around 36 inches long. Some of my buddy's killed one that was 44 inches during turkey season, it was a big around as a beer can. This guy stepped on it and then just freaked out and beat it with his gun (I would have died on the spot!).

Western Kentucky Boy

GSP
05-18-2004, 08:21 AM
42", any copperhead over 32" is BIG!

Grant
05-18-2004, 10:04 AM
I have seen VERY few, and none have been alive. Tha last out I found was during early wood duck and teal season ran over in the road, it was around 30 inches I would say.

http://www.hunt101.com/img/097735.jpg

superrman77
05-18-2004, 11:47 AM
I think a few people mistake watersnakes for copperheads. I grew up in eastern ky and you would see some huge watersnakes and if you didnt know a copperheads characteristics you would think it was a copperhead when it was a watersnake. Growing up I caught some huge watersnakes in my minner trap.

Turtleky
05-18-2004, 12:50 PM
Your certainly right about that superman, however I have heard of some big copperheads. Neighbor got one with his bush hog. It was 36 inches or so, however, thats the only one I have ever saw that was over 2 feet.

Grant
05-18-2004, 01:01 PM
Superman, you hit the nail on the head there. Most people have never been taught the difference in the two.


Heres a good example, last weekend buddy ran across this snake moving some old barn tibmers. He yealed at me and told me to get over there, he had found a Copperhead. I got there and sure enought it was a water snake. Heres the pic.
http://www.hunt101.com/img/157104.jpg

http://www.hunt101.com/img/097735.jpg

lab
05-18-2004, 01:34 PM
What are the distinguishing differences between the two? I am sure that I have made the same mistake.

A bad day hunting is better than a good day at work.

Turtleky
05-18-2004, 03:36 PM
Here is the copperhead

http://www.kentuckysnakes.org/snake_details.cfm?snake_number=6&option=posionous

Here are water snakes.

http://www.kentuckysnakes.org/snake_details.cfm?snake_number=36&option=common_name

Notice how much the color patterns resemble each other. Copperheads are generally short and fat and if you slow down and look at the head of one you can tell its a viper, they also have a blunter tail tan the water snake. However, don't just go picking up water snakes, I would think a young coperhead could easily fool you. Water snakes are generally more aggresive, I have seen them stand their ground and fight even when not cornered, I've even seen them chase people. I've never seen a copperhead do anything but run and hide.

kyfanatic
05-18-2004, 03:52 PM
Growing up in SW Va and Eastern Ky I knew plenty about Copperheads and Rattlesnakes,we used to hunt them just to kill them back then.I went to Louisiana to work in the oilfield in the 70's and did plenty of hunting there.I never thought they had copperheads in that swampy flatland (naive I guess)anyway one day while squirrel hunting in the piney woods I sat down to watch a bushytail cutting pinecones way up,I sat there at least 10 minutes before I looked beside me in arms length was a big copperhead stretched out in the sun,scared the dickens out of me! After that I started seeing them everywhere.Moral is to look before you flop down anywhere.
Glenn P.

Feedman
05-18-2004, 05:32 PM
We have over the years killed several copperheads and rattlesnakes on our farm. Biggest 2 copperheads were 41 inches long. Saw one the last 2 years on a steep hillside that we only bushhog once a year that looked bigger. He has gotten away both times but we are going to try and get him this year if he is still there.

It ain't braggin, if you can back it up.

Valley Station
05-19-2004, 07:07 AM
Dang , 44" copperhead? That is big enough to back a belt for even a fat boy.[8D]

perrymax
05-19-2004, 12:41 PM
I hunt and fish as much as anybody I know and I have never seen a live copperhead or rattlesnake. I know they are there but I've never seen one. I think most copperhead sightings are probobly rat snakes and water snakes.My grandfather hunts ginseng everyday and has seen lots of copperheads and rattlesnakes. He lives in Hardin Co. He says you can smell a copperhead.He said they smell like cucumbers.

I hear the,I know this guy who knows this guy who jumped into this nest of water moccosins at this certain lake story at least once a year.There's never been a kdfwr confermed sighting of a water moccosin east of Mulenberg Co.

quackrstackr
05-19-2004, 01:02 PM
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by perrymax</i>
<br />
I hear the,I know this guy who knows this guy who jumped into this nest of water moccosins at this certain lake story at least once a year.There's never been a kdfwr confermed sighting of a water moccosin east of Mulenberg Co.
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We got plenty of 'em over here if you'd ever like to see some. [:D]

I've seen several copperheads but nothing over what looked to be the 3' range. Had one crawl over my boot one day out of the leaf litter while turkey hunting. Thought it was a mouse until it came from under the leaves and over my boot. You talk about not moving a muscle. Not sure what I would have done had it hung a right and headed for the old pant leg. If there hadn't been a turkey hammering out in front of me he probably would have gotten swatted after he got passed.

gates
05-19-2004, 03:04 PM
If you want to see copperheads hunt around the rocky hillsides of Dale Hollow Lake. I have seen many there, and always see them late spring to early fall. I know exactly what all of the ky snakes are and how to tell the differences in them. Snakes are some of my favorite animals. Most of the "copperheads" in my area are hog nose snakes and young chicken/rat snakes. They hiss and have a "bigger" head than the banded water snakes. I have hunted all my life and have seen 1 rattler, hundreds of copperheads, a dozen sor so cottonmouths (mostly in west ky but one in the Gasper River in Warren County) and thousands of those poisonous copper-belly-rattle-water-moccasins that every body sees every day. Point is there are very few poison snakes and many nonpoisonous snakes. The largest copperhead I have personally seen killed in Ky was just over 36" but was torn up pretty bad by a 357 pistol. Most copperheads I have seen were less than 2' long. The largest rattler I have seen was killed by a neighbor of my dad and was 7' 4" long. The one I saw in the wild I did not measure, I quickly walked away from it. My guess 4 or 5 feet long.

James

Feedman
05-19-2004, 05:24 PM
I was raised around Dale Hollow lake. I agree with Gates. It depends on the area you live in if there are many copperheads or rattlesnakes. <blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by perrymax</i>
<br />I hunt and fish as much as anybody I know and I have never seen a live copperhead or rattlesnake. I know they are there but I've never seen one. I think most copperhead sightings are probobly rat snakes and water snakes.My grandfather hunts ginseng everyday and has seen lots of copperheads and rattlesnakes. He lives in Hardin Co. He says you can smell a copperhead.He said they smell like cucumbers.

I hear the,I know this guy who knows this guy who jumped into this nest of water moccosins at this certain lake story at least once a year.There's never been a kdfwr confermed sighting of a water moccosin east of Mulenberg Co.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

It ain't braggin, if you can back it up.

harlanbuck
05-19-2004, 06:04 PM
turtleky, I have seen copperheads stand on their tails and fight. I had one late last summer do that and it would jump at me and try to bite me. I know it was a copperhead cause it had a heart shaped head, and it had fangs too. I have caught alot of copperheads, and have seen 3 that was really mean, so don't be fooled and think they will run. water snakes are also mean, especially when you snag one. lol.

bowhunter112
05-19-2004, 07:05 PM
i think they were both copperheads but a few years back i stepped on one n heard it then it struck at my boot then i jumped back n it came at me then a 2 oz load of # 6's tore him in half then the next day i killed one in the same spot i figured it was a copperhead because of the diamond shape head and it struck at me then came towards me

N2MyWake
05-20-2004, 12:43 PM
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by superrman77</i>
<br />I think a few people mistake watersnakes for copperheads. I grew up in eastern ky and you would see some huge watersnakes and if you didnt know a copperheads characteristics you would think it was a copperhead when it was a watersnake. Growing up I caught some huge watersnakes in my minner trap.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

That's hillarious Superman, I agree with you fully. Everyone we've told about this snake has said "it's probably a banded watersnake", and then they see it...LOL Hopefully I can get some pics of it after he gets it framed.

Western Kentucky Boy

Carl
05-20-2004, 02:59 PM
A poisonous snake such as a copperhead cottonmouth or rattler has a slanted pupil, a non poisonous snake has a round pupil.<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by lab-lover</i>
<br />What are the distinguishing differences between the two? I am sure that I have made the same mistake.

A bad day hunting is better than a good day at work.
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P. Beyer
05-20-2004, 05:54 PM
A dead snake is a good snake. Whatever kind.

"It makes no difference whether I got anything; it has to do with how the day was spent"

Fred Bear

kyfanatic
05-20-2004, 08:25 PM
A dead snake is a good snake. Whatever kind.

P.Beyer,though I have no room to talk from my younger days,I have learned that snakes play a vital part in ecology,even the poisonous ones
It really makes no sense to kill every snake you see when many of them are actually useful,they kill rodents and pests.
Just pass right on by whenever possible!
Glenn P.

Steel foxin
05-20-2004, 09:58 PM
It really makes no sense to kill every snake you see when many of them are actually useful,they kill rodents and pests.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Sorry!! I disagree!!

GSP
05-20-2004, 10:25 PM
You should kill every snake only if you like RATS, MICE, BUGS etc.

As for some comments on the copperhead vs water snake. Most water snakes are more aggressive than copperhead.

Grant
05-20-2004, 10:44 PM
I can count on one hand the # of snakes I have killed, and I don't think any of them were intentional. About the only snake I would kill would be a poisonous snake, and only if I thought it was a threat to myself or someone else.

http://www.hunt101.com/img/097735.jpg

Ed
05-21-2004, 02:56 AM
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Carl</i>
<br />A poisonous snake such as a copperhead cottonmouth or rattler has a slanted pupil, a non poisonous snake has a round pupil.<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by lab-lover</i>
<br />What are the distinguishing differences between the two? I am sure that I have made the same mistake.

A bad day hunting is better than a good day at work.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
The cat's eye only applies to rattlers, copperheads, and cottonmouths. Coral snakes have round pupils. There are several species of snake that are referred to as "rear-fanged" snakes that have round pupils. All of the rear-fanged snakes in the U.S. are only mildly poinsonous. Snake collectors refer to them as "warm" snakes as opposed to "hot" snakes like copperheads. Some of them are not even toxic to everybody but can cause symptoms like anaphelactic (sp?) shock in some people, like bee stings do. I don't know if KY has coral snakes or not. TN has some coral snakes. Further south there are tons of 'em.

raktrakr
05-21-2004, 10:38 AM
do you want to get close enough to judge pupils? a snake is a snake is a snake

GSP
05-21-2004, 02:53 PM
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by raktrakr</i>
<br />do you want to get close enough to judge pupils?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
ED is right there about the ones in KY. Now if you don't want to mess with the end with the eyes on it you can pick up its tail. If it has a double row of scales from its vent to the end of its tail, you are ok. If it only has a single row of scales, turn loose REAL quick![:D]

lab
05-21-2004, 02:57 PM
Thanks but no thanks. I am not a big fan of snakes, so my best bet is to just try and avoid all of them. Poisonous or not. The only ones that I will not bother are a black snake and chicken snake. I have always heard that these two species will kill poisonous species. Is this correct?

A bad day hunting is better than a good day at work.

Turtleky
05-21-2004, 03:36 PM
It is my understanding that black snakes/chicken snakes whatever you want to call them they are all basically different color varietys of the same type of snake will eat poisness snakes. However I think they perfer mice and rats and other rodents.
I don't kill snakes. The only way I would even consider killing one is if it was poisonous and close to home with children.

kyfanatic
05-21-2004, 07:23 PM
It really makes no sense to kill every snake you see when many of them are actually useful,they kill rodents and pests.

quote:


Sorry!! I disagree!!

steel foxin, ignorance and fear will get you NOWHERE.
It's people with that attitude that wiped out the Elk,Bear,Turkey,Deer,etc populations of this state 150 years ago.

Ed
05-21-2004, 09:44 PM
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Turtleky</i>
<br />It is my understanding that black snakes/chicken snakes whatever you want to call them they are all basically different color varietys of the same type of snake will eat poisness snakes. However I think they perfer mice and rats and other rodents.
I don't kill snakes. The only way I would even consider killing one is if it was poisonous and close to home with children.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

The terms "black snake" and "chicken snake" cover several species of snakes. The black racer might kill the occasional rattlesnake. The common king snake, which several color phases, actively hunts other snakes. King snakes are largely immune to the venom of local, poisonous snakes. "Chicken snake" can be used to describe either of these species as well as corn snakes, yellow rat snakes, etc. Another good reason for not killing all snakes is that the mere presence of the non-poisonous species will tend to reduce the numbers of poisonous snakes through reduction of food supply and simple competition for hibernation space etc...
As for getting close enough to to see whether or not a snake has a round or slit pupil, I'm pretty darned far-sighted. I can see their eyes better at 10 feet than at 2 feet. I figure that's a pretty good thing and I've got no beef with it! :)
Another warning about the laws in Tennessee, since y'all are so close and might wander down for a visit. ALL poisonous snakes are protected in TN. You must prove that a snake was an immediate threat to you, another person, or a pet in order to kill it legally. The game wardens tend to be pretty reasonable about this definition, but the mere fact that. "It's got fangs" probably won't cut it. I'd hate to see anybody get a citation over something like this. I think that money is better spent on ammo... (he typed, lusting after a new .204 Ruger...)

Jblack
05-23-2004, 07:52 PM
my dad was bit by a copperhead when I was about 5 yrs. old. his arm swelled up and he refused to go to the hospital until his arm started changing colors from blue to black and green.
But how many have been chased by the infamous blue (black) racer snake when you were a kid? I know I have and it caught me and passed me up <u>whewww</u>!!, scared the shiot right outta me (about 7 then) although it's very funny as I think about it now.

just bein out there is enuff

Brutus Hedgeapple
05-23-2004, 08:55 PM
I hate snakes.. HATE EM'. But I won't kill one just to kill it. We killed a big copperhead in Jessamine county several years back by accident as it took off accross the road in front of us. It was about 36 to 40 inches long and beer can thick. I thought it was an awesome snake. I really wish we didn't kill it but it happened. I won't kill anything unless I have plans to eat it or use it somehow.

BH

kyfanatic
05-24-2004, 04:59 PM
But how many have been chased by the infamous blue (black) racer snake when you were a kid? I

JBlack,I just have to tell this story.Don't remember how old we were,but me and my older brother were cutting across a weed field when were kids.I was leading and come upon a black racer that started chasing me,my brother was back behind a ways and saw me running, meanwhile he was looking to see what was wrong, I run right passed him.That racer run straight up his pants leg.You never seen somebody carrying on and undressing so fast in all your days.We still laugh about that to this day.
Glenn P.

Hammer
05-24-2004, 10:36 PM
interesting discussion, we were having one similar at work this past week. As much as I have been in the woods hunting, fishing, or just goofing off, I have never seen a rattler or copperhead in the wild just Water Moccassins/Cottonmouths. I became really good at identifying those when we went to Reelfoot Lake every year. I used to shoot them in the head with my bb gun as they swam by or as they were sunning. They also love to get on the beaver dams.

We also have several species of snakes that act like they are venomous. They will coil up when cornered, strike, and even shake their tales like they are a rattler. With that defense mechanism built into them innately, I figure we have to have some rattlesnakes around, I've just never seen any. Really, I've only heard of scant reports from friends that have seen the occasional copperhead. Maybe I've just been lucky enough to never encounter a rattler or copperhead, or maybe, there just aren't too many in Warren County, not sure.

I have very early memories of my father teaching me about snakes. He used to go pick them up and show them to me and teach me about markings, species, etc. The robins hate snakes, and I've found several from observing them dive bombing and pecking then quickly jumping back.

Although I haven't seen any poisonous snakes in Southcentral Kentucky, I have seen plenty of poisonous spiders. The black widows seem to be thicker than fleas on a dogs back anymore. I sure don't remember seeing this many as a kid.

Jblack
05-24-2004, 10:42 PM
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by kyfanatic</i>
<br />That racer run straight up his pants leg.You never seen somebody carrying on and undressing so fast in all your days.We still laugh about that to this day.
Glenn P.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

roflmao kyfanatic, thats a story you will never forget about. I can just picture some kids running like the wind and one gets caught by the racer, right up the pant leg at that. I bet he won't stop to see what going on the next time he sees you flying by

just bein out there is enuff

kyfanatic
05-26-2004, 10:32 AM
Although I haven't seen any poisonous snakes in Southcentral Kentucky, I have seen plenty of poisonous spiders. The black widows seem to be thicker than fleas on a dogs back anymore. I sure don't remember seeing this many as a kid.
__________________________________________________ ____________________________
Hammer,funny you mention this.Me and my wife were at Barren River lake last year and saw quite a few around there,normally that's a rare sight.
By the way did you ever get that Ginseng going or learn to find it?
Glenn P.

dipits
05-26-2004, 06:49 PM
Killed one yesterday mowing around pond. 29 inches.

hillbilly2163
05-26-2004, 09:08 PM
i live on barren. there are plenty and i do say plenty of copperheads AND blackwidows.

guarantee it..................

cobbhunts
05-27-2004, 08:44 AM
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Carl</i>
<br />A poisonous snake such as a copperhead cottonmouth or rattler has a slanted pupil, a non poisonous snake has a round pupil.<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by lab-lover</i>
<br />What are the distinguishing differences between the two? I am sure that I have made the same mistake.

A bad day hunting is better than a good day at work.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
That's not always true although copperheads rattlesnakes and cotton mouths' do have slanted pupils. Some non venomous snakes also have slanted pupils. If you get close enough to look at the pupil then you had better know what kind of snake it is anyway. Make sense?

Hammer
05-27-2004, 08:53 AM
kyfanatic, I still have that email u sent me a few years ago about the ginseng. I have never found any, and I figure I'm going to have to go with somebody a few times and see how to find it first hand.

Grant
05-27-2004, 09:45 AM
We have quite a bit of Ginseng here in western KY, but not like we use to. My dad is a licensed dealer, I grew up with the stuff. Back when the price was so good, everyone was hunting it...theres just a handful that really put in the time to hunt it anymore.

http://www.hunt101.com/img/097735.jpg

lab
05-27-2004, 10:59 AM
I have an uncle that lives to hunt the stuff. I went onto his house earlier in the year only to see piles and piles of the stuff lying around drying. I don't think I could find it if I were to sit down in the middle of a bunch of it.

A bad day hunting is better than a good day at work.

Grant
05-27-2004, 12:51 PM
Lab, you might want to tell your uncle its illegal to be digging it now. You can't legally dig it till September now. He could get into come serious trouble if he gets caught with it out of season.

http://www.hunt101.com/img/097735.jpg

kyfanatic
05-27-2004, 01:27 PM
Grant not to nose in,but I think Lablover meant his uncle had piles of it drying out to sell from fall digging.
I grew up in eastern Ky / SW Virginia ,been hunting Ginseng since I was big enough to hike around the mountains on my own.I don't sell it anymore,just dig some for personal use and transplant some for my kids and grand-kids (to be).I figure someday ginseng will disapppear with developement and over-harvest.Maybe my offspring will still have some around.
Glenn P.

Grant
05-27-2004, 01:34 PM
Glen, after posting that, that did occured to me. Wasn't flaming him at all, just wanted him to be aware. Have seen alot of good people get busted with it before season who had no idea there was a season on it. Better safe than sorry. [:)]

http://www.hunt101.com/img/097735.jpg

kyfanatic
05-27-2004, 01:39 PM
Hammer,if you really want to learn ginseng,I'd be more than happy to take you on a looking trip,I usually make a couple trips a year to your neck of the woods,or if you wantlater this summer you can PM me and go on a trip elsewhere with me.I'm sure you can find it in your county but I never saw the big unbroken woods like I love in eastern ky. No law against lookin!
By the way haven't seen you on Fishin.Com in a while?
Good Luck,
Glenn P.

kyfanatic
05-27-2004, 01:44 PM
Grant,you're right about that.Plenty of people who aren't aware and plenty who just don't care.I find whole patches where people just dig every little bunch there was there.Ethical Seng-hunters are few and far these days,most folks don't know you aren't supposed to take less than a 3-prong or the seeds.
Glenn P.

Won't be none if you take it all !!!

Grant
05-27-2004, 03:58 PM
Glenn, another trend big corporations that we sell to areleaning twards now is only using big stuff, 5 years and older. We have an extremly hard time getting rid of the small stuff, if we can find anyone that wants it at all, actually, we won't buy any unless its 5 and up.
And the reason the season was introduced, if anyone cares, when ginseng was over 400$ a pound several years ago, everyone was digging it, to the point someone had to step in and halp preserve it. By waiting till september before digging, most plants will have allready dropped their seeds.

http://www.hunt101.com/img/097735.jpg

bowhunter112
05-30-2004, 10:43 PM
i was in a graveyard in east kentucky on a hillside and me n another guy were riding round it n a rattle snake was in the rd he shot it with his 44 mag it had 12 rattles and was 49 inches long tip of nose to end of rattles ive got the skin does ne one know what i can do with the skin

kyfanatic
05-31-2004, 08:53 PM
Bowhunter,I never made one myself,but they make nice belts,wallets etc.
you can also cure it on a board just to look at if you want.I expect a taxidermist could point you in the right direction to make something out of it.Never ate one myself but some people pay high dollar for the meat.
Glenn P.

dipits
06-01-2004, 05:46 AM
Usualy cook 1 or 2 every year if I get any give me . Some one will want me to skin for them and I will keep the meat . I prefer to fix like chicken salid . Not good enough for me to hunt .

cobbhunts
06-01-2004, 05:04 PM
I like them fried like chicken mmmmmmmmmmm!!! hey about the skin I have tanned several and all I do is stretch and tack it to a board then make sure all of the meat is off of the skin. Next pour salt all over it and rub it in let it set a couple of weeks or so and when it is totally dried out scrape the salt off then you have to work it into being soft again. Try it.

Brutus Hedgeapple
06-02-2004, 08:30 PM
Cobb, I want to fix up a copperhead hatband and I asked on another website about salt curing a snake skin. Somebody told me that when you're out in humidity, the skin would get moist from gathering moisture. Does this happen to your skins?

Bh

cobbhunts
06-02-2004, 08:47 PM
I have had to resalt a couple because of moisture. I keep them in the garage so the humidity would probably not affect them as bad.
If you wanted to spend some money I am sure there is a soloution you can apply to the skins that would do it better than salt does.

Brutus Hedgeapple
06-03-2004, 06:01 PM
Believe it or not..........one of the ways to preserve a snake skin was to soak it in urine for several days then rinse ALOT till the pee odor went away. Talk about a cheap way to do it. I can see it now, My wife catching me peein on a snakeskin in a bucket, then an ambulance with the "men in the white coats" would pull up.

BH