What about this one guys.

[Strutter]

Will the charges stick? What if he had shot and killed the guy?


DELTONA, Fla. — An angry Deltona father whacked his teenage daughter's boyfriend with a metal pipe after finding the boy naked in his daughter's room.
Authorities say the father, 45, didn't even know his daughter had a boyfriend or that the youngster had been sneaking into the home for more than a year.
When he heard noises coming from his daughter's bedroom Thursday morning and saw a stranger standing naked on the girl's bed, he swung a metal pipe. He then chased the teen out the front door and called police.
The boy was taken to the hospital where doctors closed a head wound with staples.
The father was charged with aggravated battery on a child and bonded out on $10,000.

[Hammer]

sounds like a reasonable response to me!

I think the weapon is the key and where he picked it up.

[Art]

He'd have gotten in less trouble if he would have shot the little playa.

[pentail]

20 years ago, I would have said he had went WAY overboard.

Today, with a young daughter of my own, I say he should be fined 10 grand for only hitting the little sucker once and not beating him plumb into the ground:D

[SmokeyBear]

For 10 grand I think they should at least let him have a couple more minutes with his metal pipe alone with the boy in a room somewhere....;):D

[Art]

You guys seriously believe hitting a kid in the head with a pipe was the right thing to do? The guy said he didn't know his daughter even had a boyfriend. Maybe if he was a little more involved in what was going on in his daughters life, she wouldn't have been slutting it up down the hall.

[pentail]

You guys seriously believe hitting a kid in the head with a pipe was the right thing to do? The guy said he didn't know his daughter even had a boyfriend. Maybe if he was a little more involved in what was going on in his daughters life, she wouldn't have been slutting it up down the hall.


dude,

If i catch a naked stranger standing in my daughters room, he will be damn lucky if he leaves with just a cracked skull

[Art]

dude,

If i catch a naked stranger standing in my daughters room, he will be damn lucky if he leaves with just a cracked skull

Ummm, I don't think this kid was a stranger to his daughter since he had been doing it for over a year;). A grown man, then yes, but a teenage boy? C'mon. That's part of growing up, you're not suppose to get beat in the head with a lead pipe as kid for anything, especially for THAT.

Seriously, what kind of father doesn't know a guy is sleeping with his daughter in the next room for over a year? Didn't even know she HAD a boyfriend! I don't even want to know how the father spent his time if he was that removed from his daughters life. Obviously she wasn't getting good parental attention.

[keith meador]

You guys seriously believe hitting a kid in the head with a pipe was the right thing to do? The guy said he didn't know his daughter even had a boyfriend. Maybe if he was a little more involved in what was going on in his daughters life, she wouldn't have been slutting it up down the hall.

I think the point is that the father had no knowledge of the boy, regardless of age. The father was probably strict with his daughter, wouldn't you think? Why would a daughter tell her father, BTW dad, my boyfriend and I will be having sex tonight, so please knock first.....If I were in the same situation, my instinct would be to defend my child first, and ask questions later. Finding a person in your home no matter the perps intentions would lead to charges of some sort, be it me or the perp.

[skin_dog1]

Art,
I'll assume you don't have a daughter.... Well as the father of 2, I can guarantee you if I have no knowledge of a BF and walk in and find a naked man in my daughters room he's gonna either be shot or take one heck of an ass whippin. I don't see where he did anything wrong. If he had knowledge of the young hoodlum and knew his daughter was in a relationship and she wasn't screaming for help then there is an issue. The argument in court will be whether or not he had a reasonable belief that his daughter was in harms way. I'd say walking in on a strange person naked in her bed may very well fit the bill.

[Art]

I think the point is that the father had no knowledge of the boy, regardless of age. The father was probably strict with his daughter, wouldn't you think? Why would a daughter tell her father, BTW dad, my boyfriend and I will be having sex tonight, so please knock first.....If I were in the same situation, my instinct would be to defend my child first, and ask questions later. Finding a person in your home no matter the perps intentions would lead to charges of some sort, be it me or the perp.

I can see the threat aspect and wanting to protect BUT why not just grab the boy? I'm sure the daughter was going to say they were having sex BUT you'd figure the father would know if she had a boyfriend, especially one that has been a backdoor man for more than a year.

I think it's just a case of taking it too far. It will be an expensive lesson that might cost him his freedom and I'm betting that in the end nothing will change with his daughter. Wait til daddy is in the slammer for a year... He'll have a grandchild when he gets out.:D

[raven_over_easy]

I have 2 daughters. I am very involved. Presented with that situation it really hard to tell how one would react. I will say this all future BFs of my girls better take notice while yall R out on a date I'll either be shapening my knife collection or cleaning my guns. So boys, make good choices.

[Art]

I don't have kids, but if I had a daughter and this happened then I'm putting the blame on her as much or more than the boy. If it's not rape, it's consenting and that is 50/50 blame to me. Kids are WAY more advanced these days then most of us ever thought about being. I don't know if I would have made it to adulthood had internet porn and all the other stuff was around when I was a kid.

[keith meador]

I don't have kids, but if I had a daughter and this happened then I'm putting the blame on her as much or more than the boy. If it's not rape, it's consenting and that is 50/50 blame to me. Kids are WAY more advanced these days then most of us ever thought about being. I don't know if I would have made it to adulthood had internet porn and all the other stuff was around when I was a kid.

Nah, you would have made it to adulthood, but your 7000+ posts probably wouldn't be on a hunting site;)

[Art]

Nah, you would have made it to adulthood, but your 7000+ posts probably wouldn't be on a hunting site;)

What's more scary is that internet porn is everywhere now AND I STILL HAVE 7500 POSTS ON A HUNTING FORUM.:D

[MikeKy]

The ten grand in bail money sounds like money well spent to me. However, I doubt the charges will stick and he'll probably get the money back. Since it takes two to tango, I hope he gets to post bail again after straightening out his own young'n. If he had used that pipe on both of them he might have got two for the price of one. It is difficult to believe that he knew nothing about the boyfriend and the sneaking in his house. Maybe the guy usually works nights. Hope that is the case and that he isn't just a pitiful parent. Either way, both miscreants deserve a good whupping IMO.

[Feedman]

I wonder if he had a wife living in the same house??? Seems odd that mom did not know what was going on????

[philipfleek]

You guys seriously believe hitting a kid in the head with a pipe was the right thing to do? The guy said he didn't know his daughter even had a boyfriend. Maybe if he was a little more involved in what was going on in his daughters life, she wouldn't have been slutting it up down the hall.
I would have hit him with the pipe, aint grabbing hold of no naked boy!!!!!!

[trust me]

My parents were involved in my life when I was growing up, and they never knew who was going in and out windows.

We absolutely cannot assume the guy was a bad father just because he didn't know about the little peckerhead. All we know for sure is the little dude got lucky and Dad put a whuppin' on him. Justified? Let the jury decide.

I have a 15 year old daughter. Would I take a swing at him with whatever was handy? Probably. Since the daughter is on the second floor, sneaking through the window would be hard, but I'm not claiming to know her every move of every minute of the day.

[jadkison]

the father was the the one that called the police i have a daughter . if i seen a boy in her room well i hope that don't happen

[turkeytalker]

dude,

If i catch a naked stranger standing in my daughters room, he will be damn lucky if he leaves with just a cracked skull

Art,
I'll assume you don't have a daughter.... Well as the father of 2, I can guarantee you if I have no knowledge of a BF and walk in and find a naked man in my daughters room he's gonna either be shot or take one heck of an ass whippin. I don't see where he did anything wrong. If he had knowledge of the young hoodlum and knew his daughter was in a relationship and she wasn't screaming for help then there is an issue. The argument in court will be whether or not he had a reasonable belief that his daughter was in harms way. I'd say walking in on a strange person naked in her bed may very well fit the bill.

I have 2 daughters. I am very involved. Presented with that situation it really hard to tell how one would react. I will say this all future BFs of my girls better take notice while yall R out on a date I'll either be shapening my knife collection or cleaning my guns. So boys, make good choices.

I would have hit him with the pipe, aint grabbing hold of no naked boy!!!!!!

the father was the the one that called the police i have a daughter . if i seen a boy in her room well i hope that don't happen


Art, as much as i'd love to make a comment i'll let these serve. You have no kids,wife or even pets to worry about and you have actually argued against the castle doctrine:confused:.


Duhh, must be nice only having to take care of yourself,and your big brown truck.

[Strutter]

After posting this, I was telling my wife about it. She said she's glad we have 2 boys. They were listening and I told them if I ever hear noises and come to their rooms and see a naked girl standing in their bed that they better not have any beer in there. Wife gave me the evil eye on that one.

Rob

[semperhunting]

No offense meant to anyone: but this subject is why I'm glad I don't have girls. If I was her father I would probably have done the same thing. Even if the boy's interntions are right, that's my daughter.

And in reference to Strutter's post above, with a boy you only have to worry about one; with a girl you have to worry about all of them.

[AteUp]

No offense meant to anyone: but this subject is why I'm glad I don't have girls. If I was her father I would probably have done the same thing. Even if the boy's interntions are right, that's my daughter.

And in reference to Strutter's post above, with a boy you only have to worry about one; with a girl you have to worry about all of them.

Yeah, but a girl can say no. How good were you at saying no when you were 16?:eek:

[Hammer]

Art, u seem like a great guy, but I think you're talking out of your a$$ in this post. Trust me, you'll feel differently if you have a teenage daughter. I think this father's actions were entirely justified for the information we have presented to us in this snippet of a story.

[canemaker]

Art,

No offense intended here. But, If I walk in an see a naked man/teen/person standing over my childs/teens/wifes/my bed I am not going to just "GRAB" him. As a retired law enforcement officer I know the danger invloved in just "grabbing" a naked/nude person, or grabbing anyone for example... Once you "lay" hands upon someone you then run the risk of being injured yourself....

IF the father had no knowledge of a person being in HIS house and found that person naked/nude over looking his child/teen then he could be justified in using what ever force he deemed nessasary to cause said naked/nude person to cease being there!!

It didn't matter if he was a good father or bad one, not at all... The point being he found a naked/nude man that he didn't know was there, and didn't know period, in his childs room.....

[Art]

Art, as much as i'd love to make a comment i'll let these serve. You have no kids,wife or even pets to worry about and you have actually argued against the castle doctrine:confused:.


Duhh, must be nice only having to take care of yourself,and your big brown truck.

TT, nice personal attack there.:rolleyes: With all due respect your post shows just how little you know about me.

Fact is that this guy was criminally charged, so even if you guys say you would have done the same thing, which I suspect is probably just chest pounding, you'd be wrong according to the law. So what if you would have been a tough guy and beat a teenage boy to death for boinking your more than willing daughter, you'd be charged just like him. Then not only is the daughter running wild behind your back like she's obviously been doing in this case, you're now in jail with a criminal record and likely to face a lawsuit. Talk about making a bad situation worse.

I argued the Castle Doctrine in that 1 specific case, not as a whole. The fact that the case was brought before a grand jury and the fact that the law as it's written IS currently under review by the state should tell you that it needs some adjusting and the said case proved that.

[CUZZIN]

Art until you have kids it's hard for you to say what you would do if put in a situation as that. I have a girl and dont ever want anybody touching my baby because it will be ugly and thats not (chest pounding).

[Art]

Art until you have kids it's hard for you to say what you would do if put in a situation as that. I have a girl and dont ever want anybody touching my baby because it will be ugly and thats not (chest pounding).

I understand the desire to protect your kids, I really do. However, the reality goes beyond that. Let's not forget we were all teenagers at one point and this is just how things are in your teenage years, it's the age old struggle. Kids are doing things at ages we'd be ashamed of these days.

This guy had every right to protect his daughter, but I just can't help but think he should have had a better understanding of the situation before attempting to kill a teenage boy. We know he heard noises, but is anyone willing to bet what those "noises" were? It's safe to say that it wasn't his daughter screaming for help, crying, or telling an intruder to stop. Obviously it never occurred to this guy that his daughter was 50% or more of the situation. All I'm saying is that I THINK I would have handled it differently. This situation probably repeats itself thousands of times a day in this country, and if people are beating the kids down then it's not making the national headlines.

We know how you guys with daughters feel, but how would you feel if this was your son? What if he would have shot and killed the boy, your boy? I can only imagine that you'd have an entirely different opinion then.;) I'd say most of us were in this situation as kids, I know I was.

[Luckybuck]

For 10k, they ought to give him a calf bander and a locked room with the little sh!t and 10 minutes to geterdone!
If it was my girl he would be DRT!

[carpenterguy]

I understand the desire to protect your kids, I really do. However, the reality goes beyond that. Let's not forget we were all teenagers at one point and this is just how things are in your teenage years, it's the age old struggle. Kids are doing things at ages we'd be ashamed of these days.

This guy had every right to protect his daughter, but I just can't help but think he should have had a better understanding of the situation before attempting to kill a teenage boy. We know he heard noises, but is anyone willing to bet what those "noises" were? It's safe to say that it wasn't his daughter screaming for help, crying, or telling an intruder to stop. Obviously it never occurred to this guy that his daughter was 50% or more of the situation. All I'm saying is that I THINK I would have handled it differently. This situation probably repeats itself thousands of times a day in this country, and if people are beating the kids down then it's not making the national headlines.

We know how you guys with daughters feel, but how would you feel if this was your son? What if he would have shot and killed the boy, your boy? I can only imagine that you'd have an entirely different opinion then.;) I'd say most of us were in this situation as kids, I know I was.

excellent post art! I do feel that if i was the girls father it would be hard to know what would come to your mind in the first..But at the same time i would be thoroughly dissapointed in my son if he was in this situation. Seems to me that both liked adequate parenting. They shouldn't have been doing what they were no matter how you look at it!

[Art]

OK, another question here. What are you tough guys with daughters going to do with your daughters after something like this goes down? Just pretend like it never happened and continue to assume they are a sweet and innocent princess who couldn't not have possibly brought some of this on herself? What if your daughter is caught in the bedroom at the boys house? I'm just asking because it happens all the time.

[Foam Steak]

As much as it pains me to say this :D, I have to side with Art on this one. Based on the limited amount of info we have and the fact the old man is being brought up on charges, I would say he probably over reacted.

This reminds me of one of the funniest stories I have ever heard. It involved one hunting buddy, one hunting buddy's girlfriend and one hunting buddy's girlfriend's mother. I can't repeat most of the story so I will skip to the end where I said what did you do then? reply: "I got the heck out of there"!!!!!

[CUZZIN]

OK, another question here. What are you tough guys with daughters going to do with your daughters after something like this goes down? Just pretend like it never happened and continue to assume they are a sweet and innocent princess who couldn't not have possibly brought some of this on herself? What if your daughter is caught in the bedroom at the boys house? I'm just asking because it happens all the time.
Art there is no need trying to explain it to you since you have no kids.It's one of them things that you haft to live before you can feel it.

[Art]

Art there is no need trying to explain it to you since you have no kids.It's one of them things that you haft to live before you can feel it.

You're probably right to an extent. Don't you find it interesting though that basically everyone that has posted in this thread said they would do the exact same thing or worse, yet this event made national headlines? Kinda strange if you ask me.

[turkeytalker]

What are you tough guys with daughters


I'm sorry about personally attacking you Art,didn't realize you were so sensitive. I should have seen it right off though since you refer to men who would stand up to protect their kids or home as "tough guys".

[Art]

I'm sorry about personally attacking you Art,didn't realize you were so sensitive. I should have seen it right off though since you refer to men who would stand up to protect their kids or home as "tough guys".

I'm not sensitive, I just don't like having things said about me that aren't true by people who don't know me. You can't fault me for that I don't reckon.

It's fine to protect your kids, but beating up a child gets you labled as a "tough guy" in my books. How do you think the world would look at you with a charge of "aggravated battery of a child" on your record? Not good I'm thinking, but maybe that's just me?

I thought I've asked some reasonable questions here to some of you fellas who would jump at the chance to beat down your daughters teenage boyfriends, but I've yet to get an answer.

I don't have a daughter, but when or if I ever do I'm sure not going to cover up her bad choices by beating up kids and blaming everyone but her and myself. I'm also pretty sure that I will know if my daughter has a boyfriend BEFORE the 1 year anniversary. I will also know if kids are coming a going from my house at all hours of the night. Maybe this father is an acceptable parent by your standards, but not mine. Had he actually PROTECTED his child, this would have never happened.

[carpenterguy]

As a father I still side with art on this one...You can't go around beating kids with a steel pipe. Yes I know it is wrong but as stated I think a parent should be aware if someone has been coming to their house for a year!! I mean come on..That's pathetic. I choose to be active in my sons life and I hope and will try my best to teach him better then to be in this situation..But if he was to end up their I sure hope that some Jackass doesn't decide to use a steel pipe on him. Their are other solutions.

[cornbread]

I can understand wanting to beat the guy with a pipe. But I also agree that the father should have been more involved and know what was going on in his daughter's life. Also, how many of you guys could have been in the same situation when you were a teen? I know I'm glad that I never got caught.

[GSPonGrouse]

Right or wrong, When (and this is very hard to say) my 2 daughters are 16-17 and starting to become sexually active there little boy friends better do the same thing I did and remember a very important rule. NOT IN DADS HOUSE I will split there wig without hesitation.
I was scared for my life more than once and will probably have it come back on me 3 fold with mine but I did respect Dads house enough to make sure he was at least out of town.:eek::D

[DaveR]

for all he knew it was a rapist, and that is what I would have thought if the details given are true. So looking at it that way, not too excessive.

now, from the other side of my mouth:
I can't say I never snuck around when I was a young man, but I was smart enough to lock the door.

[KYhunter79]

Protecting your kids is one thing, but I doubt he was harming her too much. ;)

Some of you need to get real with yourselves. You guys are in denial. I am 6 years removed from 16. I know what 16 year olds, and so do you guys. And it isn't all guys doing it either, your alls precious little girls are doing it too. I have a cousin that lost his virginity at 13...to a 13 year old girl. Was he ready to handle the responsibilities? No. But, it was consensual. I have several girl cousins that are in the 13-16 year old range. They tell me quite a bit and things haven't changed for the better believe me. If I had to guess I would say 80% of 15 year olds are sexually active. I hate to tell you, but that includes KYhunting forum member's daughters.

Hitting the teen with a lead pipe is uncalled for. Calling his parents and holding them until they got there and punishing your daughter for lying, sneaking and hiding a one year relationship from you is a little more sensible in my opinion.

The only reason I think the kid should get in trouble is for being stupid enough to put himself in a position to get caught like that. That's a chance you don't take, especially regularly. That leads me to believe that the dad is an invisible figure in the household. I can't believe that you guys have made the boy out to be a hoodlum, scoundrel, no good over this one little paragraph. Hypocritical if you ask me. How many of you actually weren't doing similar things when you were his age (barring the idiotic sneaking in the house while people are home)?

[MsgMills]

20 years ago, I would have said he had went WAY overboard.

Today, with a young daughter of my own, I say he should be fined 10 grand for only hitting the little sucker once and not beating him plumb into the ground:D

Now would that be with a "Plumber's Pipe" or just a regular pipe for this course of action......lol :D

On a serious note...I will agree with most father's who have daughter's...If I heard noises and I busted open the door and saw a naked boy / man standing over my daughter on her bed...I would be so scared that the assailant is attacking my daughter that I would do as the father did as well in this given news article..... This father is and was only protecting his daughter and I think he'll walk on this one....If I was on the jury, that's how I'd perceive the case and evidence......

[carpenterguy]

From what i gather it doesn't seem as though she was making it sound like rape;) He just heard noises...Remember you can't rape the willing:eek: So if it's voluntary you can't hardly justify busting the kid in the head with a pipe.

[trust me]

The only reason I think the kid should get in trouble is for being stupid enough to put himself in a position to get caught like that. That's a chance you don't take, especially regularly. That leads me to believe that the dad is an invisible figure in the household. I can't believe that you guys have made the boy out to be a hoodlum, scoundrel, no good over this one little paragraph. Hypocritical if you ask me. How many of you actually weren't doing similar things when you were his age (barring the idiotic sneaking in the house while people are home)?

I may be an old fart, but I have an excellent memory. I know full well about sneaking around. I was one of the sneakers, (and on occasion was a sneakee) but I promise you I never sneaked into a girl's bedroom with Mom and Pop sleeping across the hall. That is just crazy stupid. You're asking for a pipe upside the head, or hot lead in your arse as you hurriedly climb back out the window.

Getting caught doing the dirty in the family sedan or on the living room couch is one thing, but climbing through the window and making yourself at home for the night is begging for a whipping.

As far as Dad not being in the picture, I had a secret relationship with a girl long after her unreasonably involved and overprotective parents declared me off limits. (Imagine, parents objecting to a fine feller like me!) Kids will find a way. Even the children of kyhunting forum members.

[Art]

Well, count me as a teenager who would on occasion flip out over the opposite sex and fall under their spell. I was in full rut a few times and all rational thought went out the window, literally.:D

To me, it's the timeless game of cat and mouse. Everyone plays it all over the world. I was scared of a few fathers back in the day BUT I didn't think in my wildest dreams I'd be physically assaulted by an adult with a weapon. I can assure you if I had that I would have owned the man after a lawsuit.

I guess times are a changin, because in the early 90's when I was a teenager, the girl was actually the one that got into trouble. Taking responsibility for your own kids seems to be a dying art, and to me this story and this thread show that. It's very similar to the teenage girl who drowned in a pool here after sneaking in at 4am, only to have her mother sue everyone. The fact is that everyone who is so pro-child battery here has YET to mention how they could have prevented it or actually say they would even be angry with their daughters lead me to believe there's a bit of a disconnect with reality in 2008. They just ASSUME the dad was a great guy and this was totally on the boy, who in reality was just a fly instinctively drawn to honey.

I agree with 79, I'd be willing to bet that more than a couple of members here have been put in this very situation (sons or daughters) and did not respond by beating a child. I think some of you guys on here are simply too good of men to beat a child UNLESS you knew for certain it was life and death. You may say otherwise, but i'm not buying it.;)

[aceoky]

Will the charges stick? What if he had shot and killed the guy?


DELTONA, Fla. — An angry Deltona father whacked his teenage daughter's boyfriend with a metal pipe after finding the boy naked in his daughter's room.
Authorities say the father, 45, didn't even know his daughter had a boyfriend or that the youngster had been sneaking into the home for more than a year.
When he heard noises coming from his daughter's bedroom Thursday morning and saw a stranger standing naked on the girl's bed, he swung a metal pipe. He then chased the teen out the front door and called police.
The boy was taken to the hospital where doctors closed a head wound with staples.
The father was charged with aggravated battery on a child and bonded out on $10,000.

There are too many details missing for any of us to KNOW what "we" really would have done, however I will say this, since he was charged with "battery on a CHILD" ......

"I" have to wonder how young his daughter was (and am betting under the legal age of consent) and IF SO, that is another thing totally IMO....

IOW, for ALL we "know" his daughter may have only been 11-12 years old and THAT certainly changes thing (despite some saying that "he went overboard" IMO)

Again, we simply don't have all the information now, but you can bet IF she was "way young" things and charges will change and not in a way that would harm the Father in this case .......:eek:

Some "assume" she was 16-17 , yet the story says the dad was charged with battery ON A CHILD........so we KNOW the young boy WAS YOUNG.......(not being an "expert" in Fla law what "is a child" isn't clear though I'll admit) however had my 11 yr old daughter had some older boy NAKED standing over her, IN HER BED;....... well "conversation" wouldn't be near the top of list on things that would come to MY mind.......

"Maybe" that (to some) makes me some "tough guy", but it (or that label) changes nothing ......especially "hearing noises" (that could be muffled screams for all I know IN MY HOUSE coming from MY DAUGHTER)......

Just another "perspective" on what we don't know.....:D

[Art]

There are too many details missing for any of us to KNOW what "we" really would have done, however I will say this, since he was charged with "battery on a CHILD" ......

"I" have to wonder how young his daughter was (and am betting under the legal age of consent) and IF SO, that is another thing totally IMO....

IOW, for ALL we "know" his daughter may have only been 11-12 years old and THAT certainly changes thing (despite some saying that "he went overboard" IMO)

Again, we simply don't have all the information now, but you can bet IF she was "way young" things and charges will change and not in a way that would harm the Father in this case .......:eek:

Some "assume" she was 16-17 , yet the story says the dad was charged with battery ON A CHILD........so we KNOW the young boy WAS YOUNG.......(not being an "expert" in Fla law what "is a child" isn't clear though I'll admit) however had my 11 yr old daughter had some older boy NAKED standing over her, IN HER BED;....... well "conversation" wouldn't be near the top of list on things that would come to MY mind.......

"Maybe" that (to some) makes me some "tough guy", but it (or that label) changes nothing ......especially "hearing noises" (that could be muffled screams for all I know IN MY HOUSE coming from MY DAUGHTER)......

Just another "perspective" on what we don't know.....:D


You're right, there's not much to go on. It's kinda like the glass is either half empty or half full.

I'm personally assuming that this boy and girl are between 13-17 since the article mentions them both as "teenagers". I'll meet in the middle and say they were both 15.:D Maybe we can find some follow up articles with more details.

[drakeshooter]

I snuck in my girlfriend's room once and didn't stay but 2 or 3 minutes. It was as quite as an empty church except for her dad's snoring. I was interested in nothing but getting out of there and that's what I did. You sneak into a man's house and in his daughter's bedroom (slut or not) and you are asking for what this young man got. Period. There isn't a jury anywhere in America (except in California maybe) that will convict this man.

[Art]

She was 15. here's a little more detail.


DELTONA -- A Deltona father ended up in jail today after beating his daughter's teenage boyfriend who he caught naked in the girl's bedroom, sheriff's officials said.

Colon Raul Colon, 45, didn't even know his daughter had a boyfriend -- or that the youngster had been sneaking into the home for more than a year. So when he heard noises coming from his daughter's room this morning and saw a stranger naked, standing on the girl's bed, he swung a metal pipe he had taken from the garage, hitting the 15-year-old, a sheriff's report said.
Colon was charged with aggravated battery on a child but was out of jail this afternoon on $10,000 bail, a booking officer said. No one picked up the phone at Colon's residence today.
According to the report, Colon heard the noise in his daughter's room when he got up at 4 a.m. to let his dog out, as he does every morning.
Colon told deputies he chased Lucas Contreres through the kitchen, living room and through the front door and out into the street and called 9-1-1.
Colon's daughter later told deputies that she had been seeing Contreres for 18 months but did not tell her father about the relationship. Contreres had sneaked in thorough a bedroom window at 3 a.m. this morning to have sex with her, the 15-year-old girl told deputies.
Conteres was found at Florida Hospital Fish Memorial in Orange City where he got staples to close cuts on his head. His injuries were not life threatening, deputies said.
Contreres told deputies a similar account to Colon's. He said Colon came into the room and started swinging at him with the metal pipe. He jumped out of the bed and began running through the home to get away from Colon. Once outside, he jumped on his bike and went home. His sister later took him to the hospital, deputies said.
Although Contreres' father said he wasn't sure if he wanted to press charges, deputies took Colon to jail anyway.
By PATRICIO G. BALONA
Staff Writer

[GSP]

Will the charges stick? What if he had shot and killed the guy?


DELTONA, Fla. — An angry Deltona father whacked his teenage daughter's boyfriend with a metal pipe after finding the boy naked in his daughter's room.
Authorities say the father, 45, didn't even know his daughter had a boyfriend or that the youngster had been sneaking into the home for more than a year.
When he heard noises coming from his daughter's bedroom Thursday morning and saw a stranger standing naked on the girl's bed, he swung a metal pipe. He then chased the teen out the front door and called police.
The boy was taken to the hospital where doctors closed a head wound with staples.
The father was charged with aggravated battery on a child and bonded out on $10,000.

What if story read?

A 45 year old father of Deltona Fla. was awakened by noises coming from his daughter’s bedroom Thursday morning. Upon inspection of noises, the father discovered a stranger, standing naked in his daughter’s bed. The father grabbed a pipe and swung at the stranger, hitting him on back of the head. The stranger escaped out the front door and later was treated for wounds.

The father was charged with aggravated battery on a child and bonded out on $10,000.


I used the EXACT same facts that the newspaper reporter used, but it is a whole different story. Actually if the opening line is true (father didn’t know, etc), my story is exactly what the father knew when he whacked him. (Heard noises, found strange naked man in daughter’s room, whacked him.)

[Snareman2]

Boy, consider himself lucky. At my Casa, I would not be picking up a pipe (they are down in the barn and garage), my weapon of choice would have been a pistol. Some naked dude in my house would not go over so well with me either. I know I was young once aswell, but you have to use your head.

[Strutter]

Gee whiz drakeshooter, 2 or 3 minutes :o, they have medicine nowdays that can help with that I think. :)

Rob

[drakeshooter]

Ha, ha. Yeah well, that was 1986 or so and I was pretty young, but the point was that my clothes never came off. I was so scared that big old hairy redneck was gonna catch me in his house that I snuck right back out the window I snuck in from.

[buckfever]

Good post, Ace. I agree. Nobody can determine from these facts whether the father was even "wrong", let alone how wrong.

Art - All of your posts assume that the father whacked the kid b/c he was fooling around with his "slut" daughter. According to the article, the father apparently is claiming that he simply entered the room and saw a naked person standing on his daughter's bed. If he was being truthful, I have no problems with his actions, and the fact that he called the police would seem to indicate that he was being at least somewhat truthful.

Your arguments should be confined to whether a father, who catches a boy fooling around with his daughter, has the right to beat the kid. You don't have any daughters, but there certainly are parents out there that agree with your philosophy.

And I too remember the days when I was a teenager. And I remember how much easier it was when the girl's parents were "enablers". It was a heckuva lot easier to roll over and take a snooze in a comfy warm bed than it was to try to sleep in the bushes in the backyard. ;)

Personally, I wouldn't beat the kid with a pipe, but I'd have made darned sure to make it clear that at 15 or whatever, he wasn't quite the "man" he thought he was. Mostly, I'd give the kid a scare.

I'm predicting that there ain't a chance in hell this guy will be convicted of what they charge him with. I suspect that they'll either drop the charges entirely, or they'll talk him into a plea for simple battery and give him a fine (along with restitution) and mandatory counseling. The only reason they're charging him is b/c the the kid had to get stitches, and I'm sure his parents were raising hell.

Fact is that this guy was criminally charged, so even if you guys say you would have done the same thing, which I suspect is probably just chest pounding, you'd be wrong according to the law.

That's not necessarily true. It's not "wrong according to the law" b/c you're charged. Remember the "innocent until proven guilty" thingy. If he's acquitted, are you willing to concede that it was "right"?

I argued the Castle Doctrine in that 1 specific case, not as a whole. The fact that the case was brought before a grand jury and the fact that the law as it's written IS currently under review by the state should tell you that it needs some adjusting and the said case proved that.

Ditto on this point too. Just b/c the Courier-Journal and the ACLU are calling for a review of the Castle Doctrine doesn't mean anything in terms of whether or if the law needs to be "adjusted". All that tells us is that there are liberals that don't like it.

[Art]

What if story read?

A 45 year old father of Deltona Fla. was awakened by noises coming from his daughter’s bedroom Thursday morning. Upon inspection of noises, the father discovered a stranger, standing naked in his daughter’s bed. The father grabbed a pipe and swung at the stranger, hitting him on back of the head. The stranger escaped out the front door and later was treated for wounds.

The father was charged with aggravated battery on a child and bonded out on $10,000.


I used the EXACT same facts that the newspaper reporter used, but it is a whole different story. Actually if the opening line is true (father didn’t know, etc), my story is exactly what the father knew when he whacked him. (Heard noises, found strange naked man in daughter’s room, whacked him.)


Could be, but I'm just thinking the father sees this guy, immediately realizes he's pretty darn young and realizes that he has a daughter roughly the same age in the same bed. He doesn't see a weapon, chains, blood, gags, duct tape, ect...

Now it's possible this kid is 6'4" with a full beard and full body tats, in that case I'd be a little more understanding. Maybe he was wearing a ski mask? who knows, but I'm just assuming this was 2 average teenegers doing what teenagers do.

It could also be at that very instant that the father realized just how out of touch he was with his daughters life and took his anger out on the most obvious sign. Could be lots of things based on what little we know.

[deadaim]

I am thinking what I would do in that situation for one I would be very disapointed in my 16 year old daughter and pissed it was in my own house. I would not have used the pipe however he would possibly get thrown out the window It hard to say and having a 16 year old daughter I would rather not think about it.:) As far a being a hypocrite I am when it comes to my kids. I remember back in the day getting caught in a marine sgts. 16 year old daughters bedroom I was 17. I went out the window good thing it was open :) However this still does not change how pissed I would be if it was my daughter.

[Art]

BF, you know what I find funny? In these threads, you always seem to say you would do as I do, BUT you always argue against me? I mean, you say you wouldn't shoot a cat or dog or beat a 15 year old boy with a pipe, but you don't agree with me for sharing the same views...:D

To answer your question, yes, if he is acquitted of the charges then I will admit I was wrong to that extent BUT I still would have not handled the situation as this man did and I would not be in his position. Same thing with the home intruder case we discussed. That guy pushed the law to it's very edge, but he came damn close to getting charged and ruining his life. I would not have been in that situation because I don't shoot people through locked doors despite the law. I don't beat OR shoot people unless I have no other choice. I suspect that will keep me out of the headlines and out of the courtrooms.

I am 110% for the Castle Doctrine and the last thing I am is liberal. However, I do find the law to be vague. I think it could be enhanced. I'm obviously not a lawyer and I'm sure you're 1,000 times more hip to any legal issue than I am. To me though, in both of these cases, if there's a differing opinion between the cops, the courts, and a jury then I would think the law needs to be honed in a little sharper to avoid such things in the future.

Here's a quote from the HL about the Castle Doctrine.

"But the law did not address several key questions when the facts are disputed: Who decides whether the alleged perpetrator was really a home intruder? Police? A judge? A jury?"

[aceoky]

Colon's daughter later told deputies that she had been seeing Contreres for 18 months but did not tell her father about the relationship. Contreres had sneaked in thorough a bedroom window at 3 a.m. this morning to have sex with her, the 15-year-old girl told deputies.

That would "put them together" since she was 13.5 yrs old, most likely WELL below the legal age of consent, which would (IMO) likely get the father's charges dropped .....

And 3 AM in someone's house, was "asking for trouble" especially standing naked on the daughter's bed IMO.....regardless how many times he'd managed to "get away with it" (perhaps 18 months??)

Very possibly charges will be on the boy "consensual sex" can't take place before the legal age of consent.......:eek:

[buckfever]

BF, you know what I find funny? In these threads, you always seem to say you would do as I do, BUT you always argue against me? I mean, you say you wouldn't shoot a cat or dog or beat a 15 year old boy with a pipe, but you don't agree with me for sharing the same views...:D

I didn't exactly agree or disagree with you here. I just was pointing out that there wasn't enough info to really tell whether the Father's acts were justified.

I agree with you that the fathers of daughters have no right to beat the boyfriends with metal pipes when he catches 'em in the act. Those fathers, however, have a clear right to use force to prevent naked people from molesting their daughters. If this father honestly believed that the lad was home invader/rapist, I think he was justified in his actions.

I guess I do have a soft spot in my heart for domestic pets, but after talking with that biologist, I'm afraid to tell ya that roaming cats are no longer safe around me in the field.

I disagreed with your view of the home invader case. I thought the guy was justified in his actions. It's a tragedy, but I don't think the shooter committed any crime.

To answer your question, yes, if he is acquitted of the charges then I will admit I was wrong to that extent BUT I still would have not handled the situation as this man did and I would not be in his position. Same thing with the home intruder case we discussed. That guy pushed the law to it's very edge, but he came damn close to getting charged and ruining his life. I would not have been in that situation because I don't shoot people through locked doors despite the law. I don't beat OR shoot people unless I have no other choice. I suspect that will keep me out of the headlines and out of the courtrooms.

Don't give up your point so easily. Being acquitted doesn't mean you're innocent, it just means that the prosecutors can't prove your guilt beyond a reasonable doubt.

In each of these instances, you also assume that you would've recognized the facts that were discovered later. I don't know what I would've done in each of these situations. With the home invader, I very likely would've shot the guy if he was yelling he was going to kill me and trying to break down my door. As you point out, if I found a naked guy in my daughter's room, I may have immediately mistaken him for a rapist instead of a kid that was fooling around with my daughter.

I am 110% for the Castle Doctrine and the last thing I am is liberal. However, I do find the law to be vague. I think it could be enhanced. I'm obviously not a lawyer and I'm sure you're 1,000 times more hip to any legal issue than I am. To me though, in both of these cases, if there's a differing opinion between the cops, the courts, and a jury then I would think the law needs to be honed in a little sharper to avoid such things in the future.

Here's a quote from the HL about the Castle Doctrine.

"But the law did not address several key questions when the facts are disputed: Who decides whether the alleged perpetrator was really a home intruder? Police? A judge? A jury?"

The writer of this article clearly wasn't a lawyer and knows very little about trial procedure. The police arrest and charge people with crimes, which obviously involves an initial determination regarding whether a crime has been committed. However, the police NEVER make the ultimate determination regarding a dispute fact. Similarly, the judge never makes the determination either. Findings of facts of consequence ALWAYS stay within the province of the jury (unless the judge acquits the defendant in a directed verdict under the theory than no reasonable jury could ever convict given the presented facts).

The only problem with the way this law is written is that it isn't clear which party has the burden of proof. For example, if the Castle Doctrine is considered an affirmative defense, it means that the defendant has the burden of proving by a preponderance of the evidence that he fits within the statute's protections. However, since it involves the notion of self-defense (which negates the criminal intent of the actor), some courts might find that the defendant bears the burden of production (i.e. must plead and present some evidence satisfying the Castle Doctrine) but that the prosecutor must bear the burden of proof in disproving the defendant's entitlement to that defense.

[Art]

I didn't exactly agree or disagree with you here. I just was pointing out that there wasn't enough info to really tell whether the Father's acts were justified.

I agree with you that the fathers of daughters have no right to beat the boyfriends with metal pipes when he catches 'em in the act. Those fathers, however, have a clear right to use force to prevent naked people from molesting their daughters. If this father honestly believed that the lad was home invader/rapist, I think he was justified in his actions.

I guess I do have a soft spot in my heart for domestic pets, but after talking with that biologist, I'm afraid to tell ya that roaming cats are no longer safe around me in the field.

I disagreed with your view of the home invader case. I thought the guy was justified in his actions. It's a tragedy, but I don't think the shooter committed any crime.



Don't give up your point so easily. Being acquitted doesn't mean you're innocent, it just means that the prosecutors can't prove your guilt beyond a reasonable doubt.

In each of these instances, you also assume that you would've recognized the facts that were discovered later. I don't know what I would've done in each of these situations. With the home invader, I very likely would've shot the guy if he was yelling he was going to kill me and trying to break down my door. As you point out, if I found a naked guy in my daughter's room, I may have immediately mistaken him for a rapist instead of a kid that was fooling around with my daughter.



The writer of this article clearly wasn't a lawyer and knows very little about trial procedure. The police arrest and charge people with crimes, which obviously involves an initial determination regarding whether a crime has been committed. However, the police NEVER make the ultimate determination regarding a dispute fact. Similarly, the judge never makes the determination either. Findings of facts of consequence ALWAYS stay within the province of the jury (unless the judge acquits the defendant in a directed verdict under the theory than no reasonable jury could ever convict given the presented facts).

The only problem with the way this law is written is that it isn't clear which party has the burden of proof. For example, if the Castle Doctrine is considered an affirmative defense, it means that the defendant has the burden of proving by a preponderance of the evidence that he fits within the statute's protections. However, since it involves the notion of self-defense (which negates the criminal intent of the actor), some courts might find that the defendant bears the burden of production (i.e. must plead and present some evidence satisfying the Castle Doctrine) but that the prosecutor must bear the burden of proof in disproving the defendant's entitlement to that defense.

That's EXACTLY my point here. All I'm REALLY trying to say is that there's no way to know without being there. I take exception to all the guys who claim they would shoot the guy in a second or whatever they claim. I KNOW that's not true because we all handle things differently.

I like to play the devil's advocate on stuff like this because it's NOT one sided.

A word to the wise, this is KENTUCKY. You see a naked guy in your daughter's bedroom and you go in with guns a blazing, you might shoot your own son.:D

[deadaim]

That's EXACTLY my point here. All I'm REALLY trying to say is that there's no way to know without being there. I take exception to all the guys who claim they would shoot the guy in a second or whatever they claim. I KNOW that's not true because we all handle things differently.

I like to play the devil's advocate on stuff like this because it's NOT one sided.

A word to the wise, this is KENTUCKY. You see a naked guy in your daughter's bedroom and you go in with guns a blazing, you might shoot your own son.:D

Only if you live in Lexington...........................:p

[Art]

[/B]

Only if you live in Lexington...........................:p

No, that would be if you heard a strange noise from your sons room and walked in to see your OTHER son naked.:eek::D

[deadaim]

No, that would be if you heard a strange noise from your sons room and walked in to see your OTHER son naked.:eek::D

The sad thing is I started to say that and changed my mind:eek:

[trust me]

No, that would be if you heard a strange noise from your sons room and walked in to see your OTHER son naked.:eek::D

That's just too many unpleasant stereotypes in a single post!:eek:

[big8's]

Dont surprise me none I used to live in deltona florida and its nothing but police sirens and ambulance sirens going of all day and night. Also Deltona has the highest rate of sexual offenders of any town in Volusia county which includes Daytona, so it was time to get my kids outta there.

[cornbread]

Poor kid got hit in the head with a pipe for layin some pipe.:eek: