State wide ban on "steel screw -in steps"??

[Valley Station]

Should there be a state wide ban on the use of "steel screw-in steps" here in Kentucky?? It has been illegal for a long time on any state or federally managed property and for good reason, it damages and kills trees.
Screw-in steps leave "open wounds" which allow insects and disease to enter tree, either killing the tree over time or reducing the commercial value of the log. Also, "screw-ins" left in the tree can damage chain saws and equipment at the saw mill.
Looks like it would be "good public relations" with land owners if we show an effort to help protect their property assets and interest, instead , of BEING THE PROBLEM!!
I know myself , as a land owner, I would sure hate to see a $500.00 log reduced to nothing but "firewood".
One more reason farmers deny access to their property for hunting "I used to allow hunting, but, the last guy I let hunt left big steel screws-in steps in a big pretty white oak, ruined an $800.00 log! Won't happen again!" Shouldn't we be better "stewards" than that? What do you think??

[Birdman]

I'll agree with not wanting to ruin a good log, and those dawm 16 or 20 penny nails for no trespassing signs will sure make it ruff of a chain saw, and don't do a lot for the tree.

[Valley Station]

Birdman,
And the same goes for that "dang barbed wire" , right below it.

[Xtreme]

Not to mention that the steps are dangerous. When a person slips on a screw in they usually get "caught" in the gonads![V] I don't use em so it wouldn't hurt my feelings to outlaw em.

[GSP]

Valley, I agree with your concept about being Stewards of the land, but I have a problem with the goverment telling me what I can and can't do to the tree I own.

[Valley Station]

GSP,
My proposal was not to include property owners, but,those entering others property and unknowingly damaging their timber, costing the land owner money.
Like Birdman's comment about posted sign 20-penny nails in trees, by land owner. His property, his tree, his bussiness!

[Birdman]

Those signs are not always put there by the property owner, and how about asking the hunters, from this site to practice good stwardship and leave the law making to people that have no commen sence. I don't climb trees, hunt deer or turkey, but I do know how Valley fills about the trees. And Valley I wasn't getting a chep shot on your signs, just trying to make a point.

[Strutter]

I must have different trees on my property cause you can't find any sign of a hole in the tree where I had my steps last year. A person should ask first before using screw ins or nails or whatever when on anothers property though. That is just common courtesy.

[Ben Dover]

Xtreme,


You don't use your gonads?


Ben

[Xtreme]

No Ben, I had a Vasectomy years ago for the fear that I might sire a turd like you[:o)]

However, they[gonads] will still hurt if I hang them on a tree step.

My fishing pole still works fine but the barbs have been removed from my hook. I like to practice "catch and release".

As you can see I really and truely have a deep appreciation for a smart a$$....Unveil yourself sir and join us[:D]

[ez]

10/4 elinore.............i have been in the wood industry for over 25 years and when you have worked in the sawmill and seen all the s#%t that people have left in trees from hammers, nails, pliers, wire, insulaters, pocket knives, hitch pins, fence posts, bolts, manifolds, guns, ( imagine that ) lighters, money, ...........well you know the rest of the story..........as for ben .........and as his name states,
you all know what position he gets in?..........he likes those "gonads" slappin you know where..........that's also where i'd like to put those screw- in steps and ban them forever.......there is no need for them when we all have alternative options available.....just my opinion; but with a hidden agenda........ben needs to go or all his other friends will join us..........ez

[duckdawg]

LMAO!!!
Ben Dover got ya there Xtreme!!!!!!! just remember......better to be a smart a$$ then a Dumb a$$! LMAO @ Ben Dover

[raktrakr]

i dont use them anymore myself. so what i did was found some sq. tubing,cut off the screws and fabbed me a climbing stick....no sense in wasting them

[MULESKINNER]

Ben Dover,
Must be using too much Bengay.[:0]

Rainbows suck[:(!]

[KYhunter]

I say leave it like it is.

[camo]

I'm not seeing this as a "pressing" issue. I've used screw-ins for the past 10 years in all sorts of trees and have never noticed any adverse effects. Why get the government involved in something that a concerned landowner can put a halt to if it bothers him. I also don't see how screwing 3 inches into the tree will depreciate the lumber, when that much is usually cut off each side and intended for other uses than lumber. I've never left my steps in a tree, and I can't begin to tell you how many trees we've all seen with barbed-wire growing through the middle of them!

[grouseguy]

I have to agree with camo on this one. I just don't feel that there is an issue here worth pursuing through changes in regulations. Some things are just none of the Dept's business (like how I get into my tree stand). Let the Dept handle seasons and bag limits, and let the property owners handle property rights.

[Highbow]

Ditto, Camo & GrouseGuy, I have used them for 16 years with no bad effects. Yes, they can be danger if not used carefully but so is driving to the store. We don't need to control everything that goes into how a hunter sets up his hunting stand or before long someone will decide that Ground blinds are dangerous because it might blow over and hurt another hunters spot. I really just think leave it alone.

[taggedout]

When I use my climber I sometimes run into a tree thats in that just rite spot thats too thick at the base or it's a double hearted tree and by the time it splits into two sections it's four ft off the ground, easy to hook the stand to but it can be a real trip trying to get one foot up on the platform and grab the tree and pull up into the stand. If things go just right I'll find a branch or log close at hand and lean aginst the trunk and use it for a step, if not I get in the old BAG OF TRICKS and pull out a screw-in....and I'm gone. The land owner knows I've got it, he dosn't care, and if we givem the right to digg through that "OLD BAG" you know they will decide there's still other things they need to save us all from!
Like the man dosn't have better thing to do with his time.

Grummybear

[shogan]

I agree with everyone who says why get the Goverment involved!!! If people are sticking things in trees with out permission they will loose their hunting privelidges I suspect. Trees are allowed to grow along fence rows to hold up barbed wire. While trees can be profitable so can cows and you harvest them much sooner.

TREE HUGGERS: BUY YOUR OWN LAND AND SET YOUR OWN LAW OF YOUR LAND NO SCREW IN STEPS, NO BARBED WIRE, NO 6 PENNY NAILS, NO NO TRESSPASSING SIGNS THAT MIGHT DAMAGE THE TREE. SHOOTING SHOULD BE PROHIBITED YOU CAN IMAGINE WHAT A BULLET COULD DO TO THE TREE IT WOULD BLEED SAP FOR A LONG TIME. (By the way I use to be a tree hugger you all won't believe this I use to be a liberal)

THERE ARE ONLY 10 LAWS THAT GOVERN MY LIFE IF I FOLLOW THEM I PRETTY MUCH FOLLOW THE RIGHT TRAIL. And until a new moral issue arises I don't see any reason for a new law!

[ez]

oh yes ; i forgot to mention that horse-shoe and syrup tap and all the teeth that got knocked off my saw while i was cutting that 2 x 4 for that house i was going to build you............a tree hugger and a ; well,you all know, joining hands............ and as for the three inches screwing into the tree...........just ask your wife how much 3 inches is?????????lots of damage has been done with just three inches........i know...........
i know that the government should not be controling this ....we should...some of you just do not understand how much damage can be done just by sticking a tree peg into the very life system of the tree and making a tree a $800.00 log to a $100.00 log.........if you were in my woods; screwing my trees full of your ?????...........see ya later.....ez

[MULESKINNER]

WOW!
I must say that my eyes are opened a bit more.
I never knew that those screw in steps can hurt trees. I did notice that a perfectly healthy tree I built a stand in one year was dead by the next season. I always kinda wondered if those nails could have been the culprit?

I'm about the furthest thing from a tree hugger but I do spend a lot of time in em'(trees...not tree huggers Bendover), so I guess I'll watch what I'm doing a little more closely.

2 rules to live by is all thats necessary:
Love the Lord thy God with all your heart
Love thy neighbor as thyself.
Everything else just kind of falls into place after that.
L A T E R . . .

[Boss Gobbler]

I hate to admit but I use to be a tree huggger to. I use to slip off branches and step on that ol' rotten 2x4 and hug that tree like there's no tomorrow, then I switched to screw in steps [:D].

[shogan]

I'm a laughing thanks.

You know guys ladder stands are cheap seems like a good route to go to me. If I were going up in the air think I would go that way!

[MULESKINNER]

Shogan,
Are you gonna pack that ladder stand in and out of Taylorsville WMA?
There are some real nice ones, but they aint too mobile.
Nuke a gay whale! For allah.
L A T E R . . .

[ez]

how bout packin in your own climbing stand and just scratch the outside of the tree instead of stabbing the inside..........remember three inches ..........and maybe we should cut down every tree so we could drink and drive and not hit any trees with pegs in them......what a louzy argument..............i can't wait till ben dover and all his friend come over and screw all your trees full of holes........peg holes that is???...........as for a stray bullet, it does not do as much damage as if you liked the same tree and kept killing deer out of it, that you continually used the same holes over and over to get back up to your favorite spot, by now you would have gone down and got hung up on your gonades using the same holes........i know of only one hole that you can continually use and never wear it out and it's not out on the golf course or on a tree.... i hope your forest is full of veneer logs...........ez

[pearsonbowhunter]

hey (Ez) i know what your talking about the one hole that is LOL haha
thats a good one"""""""""""""""""""""


John

[Boss Gobbler]

They all wear out.

[Duster]

Common sense is all it takes, ASK before you use screw in steps on property thats not yours. No need to get the goverment involved in hunting any more than they are already. Also take your steps with you when you leave or change trees, not leave them in the tree for use the next year. I use climbing sticks on the private property I hunt even tho I could use screw in's with no problem.

Start trying to ban things an it might come back to haunt you in the long run. You could be like Michigan last time I hunted that state there was a ban on hunting from tree stands or elevated stands during firearm season. Yes it was against the law to even stand on a stump while hunting deer with firearms. This law was introduced as a safety issue from what I understood. Don't want any hunters falling from trees with a loaded gun. What I didn't understand was why they banned hunting from elevated positions but let you use high powered rifles. Heck no lets not shoot into the ground lets shoot across the woods at ground level an see how far the bullet travels before it hits something.

[shogan]

Sure It should be easy to pack in a 50lb ladder stand all I need is a wheelbarrow

[Walt K]

[?]

[shogan]

Heck I don't use them lets ban them.

Theres alot of things I don't use or like lets ban more products in this country; It's the american way! Free trade takes a back seat to any potential damage of misused products. Think about it before you ever invent somthing. It might get banned cause someone misuses or someone else doesn't like it.

Then lets file suits against the companies of screw in step makers for all the trees they have killed. Probably millions of trees worth billions of dollars. Support trial attorneys they need to eat too.

[shogan]

[:o)][8)][}:)][:D][:I][^][:0][B)][:p][8][xx(]

[Walt K]

Try again, that first was a test post! I don't use tree steps, but I wouldn't want to infringe on those who do, I think damage is minimal, since you remove those steps after use as compared to some of the other posts of things found in trees. Tree steps are too expensive to leave behind. Most steps have 3" screws and I would imagine that an inch of that is in bark, the other two inches actually biting into wood. I really don't see it a big problem to have to take action on as I believe the tree step is slowly dying on it's own. Most outdoor merchants I've talked to say that the climbing stand is the biggest seller today. I would guess this is due to dirtbags that steal treestands. Nobody wants to leave a nice hanger in the tree anymore.
On another note; this started out as a good post and had some good input from some. The problem I see though, was to wade through the BS posts to read some sensible posts. All the bendover,hole,etc. joke posts are in bad taste (my opinion), I don't think Cyber Hunters went through all the trouble to try to establish a reputable organization, to have some turn it into "bubba redneck joke page". You guys need to think before you post and realize that this is a public forum that has women, children, and officials from the Dept. watching it from time to time. If you want credibility with the public and the Dept., you best all clean up your act and do Cyber Hunters justice.

[shogan]

My apologies I will clean up my act. You are right I should not have fallen in to that hole.

[ez]

walt::::::::::: i guess you've never been in the sawmill when the band mill runs into one of these pieces of obstuction and the whole band rips apart and darm near kills someone.......happened back in ohio where i worked............ and i know that a hunter who continually uses the same tree because it's a good spot is not always using the same holes that he put in before........... and yes this is going to hurt the tree.......if i poked a couple of holes in you........sure you heal but a scar is left.......making an $800 tree a $100 tree ;as for the "ben dover"......................is that a name we should allow on this site?...........what do you think that implies????
i made an earlier post about this being a problem and i saw no concern other then they were going to see who it was.........still other posts were made by this individual and he was not blocked...........ez

[Xtreme]

Folks, our good friend Walt K. has a point. There is a fine line between humor and foolishness.

I fear I bit on that hook as well. From now on any "bogus" posts by any "risque" posters will be deleted.

Ben Dover, you will identify yourself in a decent manner or we will delete your post's from now on.

I am a bit of the fool myself but we must be aware of all that can access this site.[;)]

[shogan]

EZ I feel your pain seriously but I'm sorry I just don't agree Private land is private land I can burn down my trees drive nails in them, or kill them with screw in steps. What ever I want. And I will fight tooth and nail anyone who tries to control what is allowed on private land. Or someone who tries to ban any merchandise that isn't tad amount to nuclear waste or far reaching chemicals. Basically a screw in step goes in to my tree the end. Not that I want any in my trees. Think about it this way heart woods fellow feel like they should be able to ban hunting and logging. What if we all started giving into enviro wackos and curtailed logging because it kills trees remember these guys think trees are connected to the living creature earth and you and I are just like little fleas on mother earth. So if we listened to people who wanted to ban logging hum you would be out of a job. Even if they just slowed it down or made it cost prohibited it would affect you. That doesn't help when a saw goes kabloie and endagers lives to that we have OSHA (for better or worse). And we all have risks on the job mine is DRUNK drivers and angry customers.

The logging industry effects me too just not as phyically close as the saws affect you.

[Walt K]

Ed,(EZ)you mean to tell me people leave tree steps in trees that are being logged? That's like leaving $5 bills sticking in the tree. I believe you, but how much other foreign junk was in there as well? I know I've been guilty of leaving a broadhead in at least one tree in my deer hunting career! I stand with my statement that tree steps are declining each season. I use a hanger once and a while and use "climbing sticks" that ratchet strap around the tree, they're great.
EZ, I'll see you at the farm no doubt this weekend. Kerry and I will be camping by the big house, stop by, you know we always have something good cooking on the grill.

[ez]

a forest is just like a field of corn, beans, ect. which at some point someone will want to harvest with no trash in it...........ez

[shogan]

If I buy a feild of corn planted by someone else I have no choice if I harvest to weed threw the garbage. Maybe to much Johnson grass and it bogs down the combine. Or I can burn down the field and start over next year with a new crop. Quality timber manamgent takes years and is not the same thing as buying a piece of woodland and cutting down the trees and selling off the the cut over woodland. Then cussing the previous owner because he didn't take care of the timber they way you would have wanted to him to so you could make more money when you log it. They were his trees, you bought them buyer beware. Make enough money on the other nine trees and forget about it.

[MULESKINNER]

Words

[MULESKINNER]

ez,
He aint changing his mind.
Shogan,
He aint changing his mind.
I actually changed mine some though, so it goes to show you that this forum can be benificial even when you are beating the proverbial dead horse.

On another topic...
I hate to say it, but I wouldn't feel right if I didn't.
Did Bendover actually do anything wrong other than have a handle that was percieved as offensive. He may not even be what we are thinking he is. He probably is, but I havent seen anything inappropriate out of him??? His handle may just be a poor sense of humor.

I still say rainbows suck, and I still think if your on here for reasons other than the purposes dictated by the site then GO AWAY.
I just had to ask out of being fair. Believe me, Im no sympathizer of what hes been acused of being.
L A T E R . . .

[Multidigits]

Mule--My momma tells me I was born during the day...but it wasn't yesterday! Bendover and his comrads, only posted one or two posts and always on the same topic. His posts were only meant to inflame and never added anything constructive to the arguement. He was probably registered under several names to show that his side had allies.

No, he didn't do anything out of line, but when confronted with the truth, he couldn't accept it. As far as Central WMA, it wasn't created solely for his enjoyment.

[Xtreme]

I have had other folks mention handles such as "Ben Dover" to me and I agree. We certainly should encourage humor but we need not be a site that folks wont want their kids to look at. I have to be carefull as well as I am a bit of a clown myself.

I reacted to Ben's post in a way that was a bit on the risque side and I apologize.

Multi is right. He was born in the daytime and he knows a chain yanker when he sees one. Like I say, humor is great. If i couldn't be a clown at times I would explode. We just dont need names like Ben Dover on a site that is watched by more folks than us.

No offense Mule. I hope this answers your question.

Thats about as serious as I can get for one day[:o)][:o)]

[shogan]

Ben Dover may be in poor taste but before I was old enough to carry a gun, and before any kid should be roaming the net. I was calling grocery stores and asking them to Page Ben Dover. Go be a fly on the wall of school bus. Heck go see what they teach your elementry schooler in health class.

Should we promote such activity no.

When someone called the involvment with less then appropriate comments about holes to the table I was the first to apologies and my hats off to the rightous for standing up first and leading by good example. Banning Ben Dover isn't necessary come on folks thats not the worst our kids hear or read. My daught already says SHi* and once even repeated me and said FU**. Frankly Ben Dover is no worse then another post talking about free pornograph.

ON TV and radio I hear a whole slew of worse things. All of which I disagree with. Free speach does not mean foul speach. Now if said person is using foul language well then thats what moderators are for. Lets here it for those people willing to stand up and call for good manners.

[Xtreme]

Scott, I am far from a prude. And I do work in a school so I see and hear every day what kids are doing and saying. I also know that there is free speech but does that mean you should stand up in church and yell out a curse word?

All I am saying is that we should not use any handles or use any language that offends any members or anyone who would visit this site.

If we expect to be taken serious as an organization of folks who care about hunting and fishing in Kentucky we must display professionalism.

[Multidigits]

I didn't have a problem with Ben using the word GONADs. My problem with Ben, or Willie or Jimmy Neuton or who ever he is on "that day" is that not one word he added to the discussion had any value....not one!!! His only motive was to inflame those trying to give and get the information requested. When he didn't like what the "facts" were, he then became abusive. Rambling on and on without giving the factual information time to sink in is counter productive to what we do here.

Those that had a problem with what I posted about the steps and 4 wheelers, please re-read Valley's original post and then maybe you can see my point. He "asked" for a valid discussion on something that has long been banned on public land and the fesibility of expanding on that some what. I still don't believe comparing that to drunks running into trees or 4 wheeler use was relavent in this situation.

[Xtreme]

I used the word GONADS and I don't think that is to bad as are several PG13 terms that we use on here. I just think that it is improper when you log onto this site and you scroll down the threads and you see" Paddlefish gigging" and the last post is from Ben Dover or Susie Rotten/!@#$ or any other type of name.

If someone wants to enter the site and is genuinely concerned with what we are saying what will their opinion be if they see this?

I as much as anyone need to bear in mind that this site is viewed by hundreds daily.

Folks, most of us are getting ready for the bowseason to open tommorow. Let's drop this subject and get ready to enjoy our upcomeing seasons and use our energy and collective thoughts for what we were intended to do. Make Kentucky the true Happy Hunting Ground!


PEACE!!!!!!!!!!......Rick.

[Multidigits]

Good luck to everyone hunting tomorrow. I'll be at work slaving my butt off. I'll get to go Monday, so save some of 'em for me.

[shogan]

DITTO BEST OF LUCK TO ALL!

ANYONE WHO USES GONADS IN NORMAL CONVERSATION IS DEFENITELY NOT A PRUDE.

[Ben Dover]

Multidigits
8 Pointer



USA
585 Posts
Posted - 09/20/2002 : 07:07:23 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I didn't have a problem with Ben using the word GONADs. My problem with Ben, or Willie or Jimmy Neuton or who ever he is on "that day" is that not one word he added to the discussion had any value....not one!!!
...................

Well Multidigits...I will tell you #1 I am not Willie and/or Jimmy. And if you look back to that thread, you are the one that insulted me, I never became abusive. Your insults have caused you to lose all credibility on all subjects with me.


The Ben Dover name came about because that's what I felt the State was doing to me with my tax dollars....esp concerning that particular WMA.

As for identifying myself...Why should I? Ban me if you must, but with all of this hornets nest stirred up, I'd like to keep some anonymity. As for a little humor, it seems like it's needed around here.

Good Luck this season

B D

[shogan]

Who's ready to go hunting?

Walmart has screw in steps for 1.95 heck at that price I don't even have to pull them out.

I'M JUST JOKING!!!!!

[shogan]

I'M SPEECHLESS

[Big58cal]

In case anyone wonders, including the author, I deleted the post by ynothirekybiologists. It's not censorship. It was deleted because it was in very bad taste, and demeaning to people on here (refering to their intellegence level).

Jimmy, Willy, Ben, Ynot, are all welcome to post anywhere on this site, as long as it is in good taste. The moderators are here for a reason. The webmaster can't be on here all of the time. He trusts us to use our judgement and help control the content so that this site will be fit to view by people of all ages.

I've gone into people's posts before and taken out cuss words and such, but this was the first that I have deleted. I believe that everyone should be able to voice their opinion, however when it comes to demeaning people's intellegence, that is something that I see no purpose in.

[rlb165]

I know this ain't the main point of this forum, but "gonad" ain't really a bad word. When my son was born, that word was used pretty often in some of the "owner's manuals.

Main Entry: go·nad
Pronunciation: 'gO-"nad
Function: noun
Etymology: New Latin gonad-, gonas, from Greek gonos
Date: 1880
: a reproductive gland (as an ovary or testis) that produces gametes
- go·nad·al /gO-'na-d&l/ adjective

[shogan]

BIG 58 I APPLAUD YOU.

PEOPLE CLAIMING FREE SPEECH HAVE TRAMPED ALL OVER THIS COUNTRY.

FREE SPEECH DOES NOT MEAN FOUL SPEECH!

IT MEANS A RIGHT TO SPEAK FREELY REGARDING RELIOSOUS AND POLITICAL IDEAS. WE HAVE TURNED THAT INTO RIGHT TO LIE, BELITTLE, POROGRAPHIZE, AND BASICALLY LOWER THE STANDARDS IN THIS COUNTRY.

HOW COME THIS POSTS GOES ON FOREVER BUT NO ONE RESPONDS TO MY POST ON SAVAGE ARMS REFUSING TO WORK ON ONE OF THEIR OWN RIFLES. I'M STILL FLABBERGASTED. THEIR SITE CLAIMED THEY WOULD NOT SEND A GUN BACK TO THE PUBLIC THAT WAS UNSAFE. WELL A GUN WITH A SAFTEY THAT DOES NOT WORK IS VERY UNSAFE. EVEN A DUMB *** LIKE ME KNOWS THAT.

[Ynothirekybiologists]

Sorry that we voice our opinions here....thought this was a public forum....sorry our opinions are different from yours....we see now who controls this site....surely not Darton anymore!! it was not demeaning anyone, just stating a simple point of view!! You deleting my post was not right. I have read alot of other posts on here that were alot worse with the sexual inuendo language etc. so delete their posts. if all is far then no more comments like shogan's "even a dumb*** like me", no cuss words, no sexual references nothing!!! this is not a perfect world...and all is not fair in love and War. so ban jimmy, willie, and ben now if you feel it is necessary, but justify your reasons.
Big58cal: you are getting good at trying to stick a sock in our mouths when you don't like what is being said!! just like you stating your final opinion on central wma and then locking the topic.....yea that is the proper way to handle the situation. so you are no better than any one of us, so don't thrust your dictatorship of moderator on us. my opinion and what i see!!!! take care, jimmy neutron

[Ben Dover]

"It's not censorship. It was deleted because it was in very bad taste, and demeaning to people on here (refering to their intellegence level)."


<b>censorship
SYLLABICATION: cen·sor·ship
PRONUNCIATION: AUDIO: snsr-shp KEY
NOUN: 1. The act, process, or practice of censoring.

</b>

<b>censor
SYLLABICATION: cen·sor
PRONUNCIATION: AUDIO: snsr KEY
NOUN: 1. A person authorized to examine books, films, or other material and to remove or suppress what is considered morally, politically, or otherwise objectionable.

</b>


You can say "It's not censorship." but that is exactly what it was. You censored a post because <b>YOU</b>and possibly a few others took offense to it and thought it insulted their intelligence. That's fine, but if you delete a post everytime someone is offended, you will be able to do nothing else.

I ask if this is a public forum or is this Multidigits and his followers private forum? If this is a public forum and I am allowed to state my opinion, even when it opposes the great and powerful Oz (Multidigits) then this forum is fulfilling it's purpose. If I can't have a descenting opinion from Multidigits without the fear of being Censored, then I don't want to participate here.

Multidigits, you will not intimidate me


Good Luck

B D

[rlb165]

Ben D, I can see both sides of the censorship issue. To be honest, I tend to agree with you a little bit that things are a little heavy-handed right now. I feel like if someone feels strongly enough to post about something, locking or deleting that post is probably only gonna make them more upset. The easiest thing in the world is to NOT discuss something, and just walk away.

You just ended a post by telling Multi that he won't intimidate you. That would have come across as someone really standing up for what they believe in, if it were not for that ridiculous handle you hide behind. It just kinda feels like you are ALREADY intimidated.

I just realized something. I was gonna try to quote one of your previous posts or something, to try to demonstrate some good point I feel you've made about something, and I honestly can't remember anything you've said before this last post. I promise you I don't mean that as insult, it just dawned on me that I don't take you seriously enough to remember what you've said because of your handle/anonymity. I know its none of my business, I'm honestly trying to help, I hope you'll take it as such.

Richard Lee Burton

[rlb165]

Shogan, I just saw your post about the Walmart screw-in steps. That was HILARIOUS![:D][:D][:D]

[Multidigits]

You guys are a trip! Go back and read everything that was posted on the Central thread and you'll probably see that nobody mistreated you. You continueing this on that front is borderline childish. You were presented the facts about Cnetral and you couldn't accept it. That's fine, because I know others that didn't like the out come of that issue also. But they haven't acted like you guys have.

What started this was the fact that you basiclly called me and an employee of the Dept. a liar for reporting to you what happened with the mowing at Central. The person, who wanted to remain annonomous, is a well respected member of this forum. Everybody knows him, and had he reported about the mowing, it wouldn't have been questioned.

Then when you were informed of the Dept. position in relationship with Central, you still couldn't handle the truth. All of you still have a problem with the Dept. over something, dating back to the hiring of J. Day as deer coordinator. That's nothing that Cyberhunter's did or any member of this forum.

That forum topic was closed because it was done, pure and simple. There was nothing else that could be said. Some liked the out come, some didn't. That's life! That WMA or any others like it, were not created solely for your use or any other individual. Their for the public, and have to be managed as such. I'd venture to say that with you attitude, you couldn't go to any WMA in this state or any other and find one that suited you 100%.

Censorship would be what would happen if you(Ben Dover) were not allowed to submit an reply, which is exactly what would happen if this was my site. I've yet to see anything out of you that had any value to the argument at hand.

OZ[xx(]

[Big58cal]

The post that was deleted basically said that because people are in college or have degrees, they are smarter and everyone should listen to them. Then it went on to say that a lot of the people on here probably just barely graduated high school and they didn't know anything.

I can speak from experience on this. I have a degree, but that doesn't make me any better than anyone else. Even though I do have a degree and am supposed to know more than other people, I would put my uncle (someone who "barely graduated high school") up against just about anyone as far as being able to identify plants, animals, and knowing their biology and behavior. A friend of mine quit school when he was in the 7th grade. He's now one of the best tool & die makers in his area, and teaches me something (about everything) every time that I am around him.

If anything, the people that are supposedly a higher level of intelligence and think they know more than others, are actually lower in intelligence because they don't realize that school doesn't teach you everything. A lot can be learned from these supposedly "stupid" people.

The post about Central had gone as far as it was going to go. People had stated their opinions on the subject and it had been discussed. The latter part of it was starting to get "hairy" in that people were starting to attach others because they KNEW they were wrong. Had it not been for this, the topic may still be going.

If memory serves me correctly, there have been a grand total of 3 topics locked on here, with the exception of the VOTE topics, that everyone knew would be locked after a certain time period. Three out of how many hundreds??? Also, I only know of less than 5 individual Posts that have been deleted. I know of 1 topic that was removed, and that was one that I voiced concern about to the webmaster, who removed the topic himself. All of this encompasses about 2-3 years.

This is far from trying to exclude people or shut people up. This is just trying to keep a little bit of order, and to keep from some areas turning into an all out fight. This site is here for information and the exchange of ideas, as well as entertainment. It's not meant for individual people to come and try to pick a fight.

[Ben Dover]

Multi digits, it is you who needs to go back and look at the WMA thread.


This was my first post here, had been lurking and this is what I wrote.

"I had been told that PR money was being used there...something to check in to. Also, I find it very odd that the area was purchased for Dog training and trials but some retriever enthusiasts have been deterred from using Central. I find it very odd that my license fees are going to support what is basically a private bird Dog club.

Like my name says....Ben Dover"

You replied "Bird watchings not really my game either. But I bet Ben Dover will go with you!!!" suggesting that I am a bird watcher (non hunter) and implying some other things about me and those other posters.

I then replied

Thanks for bringing me into your insults Multidigits. You show that you are a real class act and your insults make me want to believe your ramblings that much more. By trying to insult me, you've lost all credibility in my eyes and probably in a few others eyes as well."



From my first 2 posts....which of your facts couldn't I accept? So where did I call you a liar? You still believe that I am the same person as willie or Jimmy, but I am not. SO are you callin' me a liar? Why would you ban me Multidigits? I made one post and then you attacked my credibility and my sexuality. My 1st post was not to try and further the argument at hand. It was to give my opinion about what my excise tax dollars are being used for and the possibility of PR money being used (trying to find out the truth). How did I wrong you that warranted your attacks?

You can believe what you want, but the fact remains I am not Jimmy, Ynot or Willie and had done you no harm. Guess you've made an enemy with your accusations and your attacks. You've lost all credibility.

good luck

BD

[Ben Dover]

Big58cal

I understand why you felt the need to delete it. The only argument I have is that you said it wasn't Censorship when in fact it was. You don't have to justify it to me...but call it what it is. Censorship. You felt that he was insulting and didn't want others to get upset or hurt and deleted it. That was your call. But by definition, it is censorship.


BD

[Multidigits]

OK, Ben you win. I'll appoligize for the attack on your credibility??? That was in reference to the PR money which the information from the DC said wasn't used at Central because of the unique status of that WMA. Do to the fact that Roy Grimes is not hiding behind a ficticous name, I have to give that report more credibiltiy than the one from you.[8D]

I can't appoligize on the alleged attack on your sexuality. I'd say you did that to yourself when you named yourself Ben Dover. Most men don't Ben Dover.[xx(]

Your distrust of the Dept. is a problem you'll have to deal with on your own. [:(]

With Central having very limited hunting, and you not saying you were a field trialer, I incorrectly assumed your must have been a bird watcher. For that I appoligize.[B)]

I love these little smiley faces, and trying to decide which one to use!!![^]

[Big58cal]

OK, it was Censorship.......just like all of those beeps that you hear when someone cusses on the radio, blocking out people's faces on COPS, and the black bars over certain areas of people's bodies on TV.

The point though is that the post would have served no purpose other than making people mad and making other people feel bad.

[rlb165]

After this post, I'm gonna try to take a chill-pill, and go work on a blind.

""The post that was deleted basically said that because people are in college or have degrees, they are smarter and everyone should listen to them.""

Ok, that could be seen as demeaning to those w/o a college degree. You would think someone with a degree would show a little more tact than to post something like that, wouldn't you?

Here is some irony:

About this time last year,(I think), someone posted a question about killing cows during the elk hunt, while the herd is still in the growth stage. There weren't a whole lot of responses to the question. I think CSS said something about avoiding the "Sacred cow" thing right from the beginning of the program. I made some kind of comment that issuing the tags wasn't the same as killing all 6 cows. Then somebody else responded. They started off by saying that killing 6 cows would have a negligible affect on the overall growth rate of the herd. They might have also mentioned the "sacred cow" thing. They finished their post by saying, as I remember,""By the way, the Biologists involved in this project have among them______ degrees in _____, _____ degrees in ______, and a combined____years' experience. Do you think their opinion is more valid than their's?"".

Does anybody remember who said that? I am stil surprised that someone in that position would say something so childish, but now that someone's post has been deleted for saying essentially the same thing, apparently I'm not the only one who doesn't like things like that. I guess I'm more surprised by the way so many people seemed to gravitate toward the original person who degraded somebody for not having ___ college degrees.

[Ben Dover]

So you think I have distrust of the Dept. When in fact I have first hand knowledge of retriever enthusiasts being given the run around for using that WMA while Pointer guys have a permanant kennel on the land.


As for the PR money, I told you what I'd heard and said it was something to look in to. Didn't say it was Gospel.

You also assumed I bend over. When I was tellin' the sportsman to bend over with their use of that WMA. They pay for it, but they get limited use of it.

It's funny that I mention retrievers...but you assume I am not a Field Trialer. There are many types of Field trials and that WMA should be open to all of them.
And...since you assumed I wasn't a Field trialer and must be a bird watcher...you yourself imply that their are only 2 uses for that <b>WILDLIFE</b> manaagement area.
BD

[Ynothirekybiologists]

By the way yes i did mention that yes we have a higher degree of education, but i also stated that we have more experience and amount of time spent hunting etc than most of you on here. that was not meant to say you are stupid, that is the way you took it...if i wanted to call names at you i would have certainly came right out and said you are a moron, but i am not saying that.
multi as far as calling your info from the employee of kdfwr a lies, no i don't think he has the story right. i also have pertinent sources in the realm and that answer you gave was nothing but...here this is what kdfwr says is happening but in reality they just are covering up the fact that central is managed by field trialers. have you ever been to central? if not go there and tell me the benefit of mowing the area to the ground via orders from the higher....mow everything taller than 6 inches. if they wanted to set back vegetative succession then why not perform prescribed burns on a rotating basis throughout the property?????? why? because that is not what the field trial assoc wanted. the field trialers have been wanting the mowing to take place for along time, for one reason...so they can see their dogs better. period there was not one ounce of wildlife mgt in the decision to bush hog. ky sportsman should care about how our money is spent and it is not being spent properly at central. quote multi "That WMA or any others like it, were not created solely for your use or any other individual. Their for the public, and have to be managed as such"
there YOU said it central should be managed for the public!!!! not for the use of individuals or an individual organization.

as far as commenting on your statement about me having a problem with the dept? i will not start it again... you know how i feel about the hiring process in ky via the register and then hand picking who they want regardless of the top 5 scores. you guys ever gave a thought to why certain individuals remain anonymous? you don't know who we work for or who we did work for, you don't know where we live, or anything about us. sorry the masked bandit of jimmy neutron will never be unveiled...
the topic that was deleted was one of jimmy's about the topic of kdfwr hiring process. roy grimes has not visited since, that all was not jimmy's fault.....Darton continued the conversation with DC via email and told the truth the way it is and some feelings got hurt and tempers flared. who else to know the processes and daily interactions and politcal bull crap and the who knows who then this sites own Darton.

[Multidigits]

It's not censorship simply because nobody has been prevented from saying anything they wanted to say. Nobody was CENSORED!

"we have a higher degree of education, but i also stated that we have more experience and amount of time spent hunting etc than most of you on here" --Baseless and false!. I doubt that you spend more time in the woods than I do and I'd say several others would be in that same boat.

On ALL OTHER POINTS you make, your right. Central is managed for field trialers. The grass was mowed for them. It's not managed for the best hunting that could be done there. It's managed for dog trainers. The limited hunting allowed there is for bow deer and squirels. Read the discrition of Central in the guide and that's what it is. Just like you say it is.

So Ben, your main complaint is that retrievers have to play second fiddle to the pointers???? Man that is serious, I don't blame you for being mad!!!![:(]

[Ynothirekybiologists]

Multi quote: "The grass was mowed for them. It's not managed for the best hunting that could be done there. It's managed for dog trainers."

question? so hence all that i have said and all the bickering of central...you admit that central WAS mowed for the field trialers (but you gave me crap saying i was calling you and your source a liar). next, that statement on mgt for the best hunting that could be done there....well, i am not complaining about the hunting opportunities at central, i upset that the mgt goals/plan of the property are not being followed. there has to be a mgt plan for all "WMA's" in the state and all include the mgt of wildlife species....is central being managed in a way that we can call this a Wildlife Mgt Area, and can we justify spending thousands of dollars a year on its up keep and care? (sportsmen and sportswomen pay for conservation). I recall someone making the statement that central is our most expensive wma in the state. in my opinion that is misuse of money. i feel the kdfwr should be completely handsoff at central if that is the way the area is going to be "managed". a public area should suit the masses, not one user group, right?

as far as continueing the stuff about what i said about having an education blah blah blah, i believe i used the word MOST, which does not mean ALL! it would have been different if the post that was deleted would have been directed at a certain individual. BTW i believe i included education, work experience, and field time in the original post...but i guess we can't go look at it due to it being deleted (hehehe which i guess doesn't mean censored...just deleted)

one more- dog trainers? I want to know how many people go to central to train their dogs? well with no cover now, no birds, no training...another user group lost via the actions undertaken at central.

curious??? so you said i am right on ALL other points??? hmmmm? interesting.
"gonna make ya famous" ----- jimmy neutron

[Multidigits]

Damn, jimmy, and you were doing sooo good! [:p]

Central is an area purchased a long time ago for the specific use of field trials and dog training. That was explained to you several times. The information was included that showed the original agreement to allow the field trialers to manage the area like they wanted. Hence, if they want short grass so that they can see their dogs then the management goal is being met.

When you question my source on the reason for the bush hogging, I report the truth. that being that the area had become over taken by saplings and sumac trees. The long term goal is to return this area to strip mowing in the future, on a 3 year cycle. You said this was alie. It's not. The source is a well known contributor to these forums and is credible.

"i upset that the mgt goals/plan of the property are not being followed"-- The management goals are to manage for field trials and dog training as seen fit by the field trial association. They wanted it mowed, so that goal has been met.

Central is a wildlife management area, but as reported to you by mRoy Grimes through excepts of a letter from him, it is unique in nature and that it's goal is not to increase huntable populations of game. The field trailers release their birds on the day of the trials.

"I recall someone making the statement that central is our most expensive wma in the state. in my opinion that is misuse of money. i feel the kdfwr should be completely handsoff at central if that is the way the area is going to be "managed"---Your entitled to your opinion here, but you have to be realistic in that your not going to change the policy that's been in place since 1962 concerning this area.

"one more- dog trainers? I want to know how many people go to central to train their dogs?----Gassett reported to one of the Cyberhunter's that 1600 dogs were ran on Central last year. I don't know where he got this number, so don't ask.

As far as your education goes, I'm sure your maxed out on it.
What I don't understand is why this is so hard for you to understand.
The facts speak for themselves. I suspect it because of your scorn for the dept. on a whole and you don't want to believe anything that anyone from there will tell. That's why this topic has long been declared dead. THERE IS NOTHING NEW TO REPORT OR DISPUTE!

[Big58cal]

You're right Jimmy. You've been right all along. It's a big conspiracy against you and Willy. I think you should boycott everything to do with the KDFWR to show your displeasure. You know, if I were you and I had been lied to, Censored, called a liar, and everything else, I would move out of the state.

THAT'LL SHOW 'EM!!!!!! SEE IF THEY GET ANY OF YOUR LICENSE MONEY TO USE ON FIELD TRIALERS!!!!!!!!!!!

You've shown us "commoners" the light! How can we thank you enough!

[Ynothirekybiologists]

the area was not being taken over by saplings and sumac!! that is complete BS!!! Wasn't some of the area already setup on a strip mowing rotation performed by the seasonal technician and manager? So when was the last time the entire area was bush hogged (since 1962)??? yes there is an agreement between kdfwr and the field trialers, but still the area should be enjoyed by all, not just one user group! Why should we foot the bill to groom and trim the grass there? just how much money and man hours does field trialers volunteer? NONE! well they did one time...they came in with dozers and removed some very important nesting habitat for songbirds without kdfwr consent. truthfully we will see what happens there next year...will they mow the entire thing again? only time will tell. wonder how much money was spent on supplying field trialers a nice pretty dog field trialing area????
"----Gassett reported to one of the Cyberhunter's that 1600 dogs were ran on Central last year" yep probably so but i asked how many people were using the area as a dog training area....not dog trialing area? ask how many of those 1600 dogs were owned by kentucky residents, not many most dog trialers are from out of state and use our public grounds tailored to fit their need. what about the beagle field trialers? what are they saying? i would like to read the original agreement between kdfwr and the field trialers, and from where did they gain their interest in the property via deeded property rights etc? BTW this is not in anyway misuse of a public forum...do you disagree that this is not what should be going on,debating and discussing different point of views. there is always a time for change...you get people informed on where the money is going and people see their money is not being spent on ky conservation, people may stand up and say enough is enough! i want my money spent else where!

stealing from another very gifted author:"Oh, and one more thing. I'm re-learning what some of my ancestors learned some 230 years ago after coming to the new world. Just because your leaders seem to be looking out for your best interest today, does not mean that they will be tomorrow. You NEED a say."

Don't be a lemming!

[Ynothirekybiologists]

see there!! big58cal, coming out and making a comment like that...and you act like you are of higher stature than me just because you have the mighty power of "goderator"??

[Big58cal]

If I were "goderator" as you say, you would not be posting on here at all. Keep that in mind.

I'm going to impose my "goderator" rights. This topic was for Screw In Steps. Also, it is in the Cyberhunters Public forum, which is the wrong place. The direction that the topic has turned into is not about Screw In Steps at all. If people want to comment on that topic, fine. If you want to comment on Central or something else as dead and beat, please do it in one of the other forums.

[Duster]

What the heck does this discussion have to do with screw in steps ???

[Multidigits]

Jimmy, I tried to send you an email with proof of what you've been asking. But apparently you've registered with a bogus email address. If you want the information, you'll figure out how to contact me.

[shogan]

Did you guys try to hunt today. I thing you boys have some pent up anger. Go kill somthing and release them endorphins. Or go to the gun range. Just do something. Put yourselves on a 24 hour ban from the net. Just see what happens.

I didn't see any deer but I did manage to screw in 14 pairs of steps and leave them. By the way while at wally world I saw strap on steps.

If your wifes asks you to buy a strap on well she probably wants you to save the tree.

[Xtreme]

Shogan, I'm laughing so hard I can hardly type[:D][:D][:D]

Don't you ever leave us!![:o)]

Anyway, it is to be noted that the "red button" should have been used here but it looks like I am to late to "rescue" anything so I think I'll just watch.[;)] I will say though: For one to claim to be college educated there is some really bad grammar and punctuation used in a few post's here. As for questions and comments about the hireing process I was probably the first to raise this question. I have made as many comments about it as anyone. My question is....what the heck does this have to do with CYBERHUNTERS? This was all way before we were a organization.

As for what Big's action was regardeing the locking of the Central WMA thread I support it a hundred percent.

As for being a moderator, well you have to take in consideration the fact that this site is PRIVATELY OWNED and the moderators are en trusted with seeing that it does not become "distatefull" and "offensive" to those who visit it. Like it or not, none of us own it and it all boils down to the very fact that we can converse on here is a favor given to us by someone else.

Hang in there Multi and Big, If it gets to bad just declare "Broken Arrow" and I'll hit hit the red button and nuke us all![}:)][:D][8)] [I like theses little faces to!]

[Duster]

Shogan.... I might have known it was you that put the whammy on my ATV.. Hey ya want to come down an take it back to Mid-South tuesday an get the hex off it...[:D]. I see ya found you some strap on steps..[:0], with all this ruckus on steel steps I am curious about the ones I use if needed. They are aluminum not steel, just the 2 1/2 inch lag bolt that goes into the tree about 2 inches is made of steel. Sure makes it a lot better whan you have to use several of them because they are a heck of a lot lighter an take less room to pack. I started out with 12 steps an 20 lag bolts..still have 12 steps an 20 lag bolts after ten years.

[Multidigits]

Duster, make sure your gas ain't turned of. Mine ahs a goofy gas valve that's not marked very well as to what position is on.

[Multidigits]

Mjiers has a stick ladder on sale for $40. Strap on. Won't damage any trees.

[CSS archer]

Okay.... I'm confused, who hit who first?[:D] And...I thought I saw my name...It wasn't me, really[:0].

I use both screw ins and straps, climbers too. The real threat to our future forests are the need to develop for homes and malls. How do we solve that?

[CSS archer]

Oh yeah, I started to be grammatically correct and say "Who hit Whom", but I was afraid some may incorectly pronounce Whom like(home) and we'd be right back in the sexual arena again[|)].

[GSP]

Mr. Archer, Mr. Archer, I saw the whole thing. Do I get to sit up front if I tell???[:D]

Ya gotta love it!

[Multidigits]

I guess indirectly CSS could be held responsible for some of this![B)]
If he had used his power and influence with the Dept. BigWigs and gotten Jimmy the job position he wanted, I doubt any of this would have taken place![}:)]

Congratalations on making meat yesterday and in Colorado![8D][:p]

Back to the controversy. I've used tree climbers and portable, hanging stands for most of my deer hunting career. I can show you trees at Ft. knox that I've climb nearly every year since 1964. They are still alive and growing. From one year to the next, the bark goes back to as good as new. Yet, they are probably banned by diffinition of having a barb that damages the tree. I've never asked for an official opinion on if they are legal or illegal. I'v since quit using them in favor of ladder stands or climbers, except on my own property. Having a stand up a tree, with a chain and lock on it, and no steps or ladder up to it, eliminates most of the threat of stand stealing.

[CSS archer]

Ya see Multi, I know not who Jimmy is, the problem may very well be that I highly recommended him for the job, therefore he would have went to the bottom of the list! Don't you remember anything? It's not who you know it's where you grow, or so I once heard!

[shogan]

Well today I used my first cable climber (ugh) once i got way up there I wish I had some screw in steps to get down. 8 feet may not be far to jump but it's sure hard to retrieve your equipment if you do.

[rlb165]

CSS, I hope you didn't mind me using your name trying to jog people's memories on that thread I was talking about. I didn't mean to imply you said anything controversial or anything on that thread, it was just that your post was the only other one I could remember. By the way, while you were out west, I had meant to get on here and post that you had said that the whole "shoot more does" thing was just a joke, but I forgot to do that. On a completely un-related matter, are you gonna be taking any more trips anytime soon?[;)]

Multi and Shogan, I don't know why you guys keep talking about methods of climbing trees in this thread, but it's very annoying.[:o)]

[Xtreme]

This thread is the Jerry Springer of the hunting world. Good night all![:o)]

[Walt K]

This thread is a good example of my concern of CyberHunters and how effective they'll be on their mission statement of viable information concerning hunting/fishing topics. I defend Mark's (big58)position to delete anything that may hurt the credibility of CyberHunters.If anything, he doesn't delete enough.
There are 92 posts on this thread, 48 (including this one) have nothing to do with treesteps. There are 1073 hits on this thread, so don't think there isn't someone out there watching.
How effective is internet discussion really when it's the same 20 or less people hashing out and whining about stuff that sometimes gets downright ridiculous. Wouldn't it be better to have 100 different people responding to a topic so that the KDFWR may actually think this is a good cross-section of what sportsmen are thinking across the commonwealth? You could actually pull that off if EVERYONE decides to stay focused on the topic of these threads. Look respectable and more will post. I'll be the first to agree that blowing off steam is healthy for looking at all angles of a topic, let's just do it with merit and COUTH! :o)

[Birdman]

Walt it's good to hear from you, I agree with most of what your saying, but you need to remember this site provides a place for people to converse with one another as if we were in the field, in other words a place to bulls--t. You know as well as I hunters do that as well as anyone. Now when there is business to take care of at least in the past we've addressed it.

People (hunters included) sometimes just like to talk or simply bulls--t, I don't think anyone means to make anyone made, their just messing with one another. At least I hope that's situation. And if someone is watching they got their eyes full on this post.

[rlb165]

I want to be very clear on something: I don't want to participate in these discussions if I'm to feel that we're supposed to maintain some kind of professional demeanor, just on the CHANCE that someone (besides you CSS[:D]) from KDFWR MAY BE looking in (lurking) from time to time. If someone wants to register and enter the discussion, that would be wonderful. On the other hand, if the best we can hope for is for one of them to jump in on a thread that affects practically none of us (hiring policies), and start making demands on how they MAY grace our presence if only we would rise to their expectations....No Thanks.

It was my understanding that we would discuss issues, then, if warranted, bring the issue to vote and present that vote to the proper personnel. I agree we should be professional in that regard.

I'm not saying there aren't serious issues to be discussed, I've got as many as anyone. But if there isn't gonna be a little (or a lot) of BS'ing along the way, I worry that we're gonna be like some of the other clubs, often wondering why more people don't belong.

Obviously, this thread has gotten severely off-topic, but people have been posting in a manner they're comfortable with. If we start worrying about offending somebody with every little PG-13 comment, does that encourage them to raise their standards (which IMO haven't been that low anyway), or to quit posting?

Having said that, I would be against a law banning screw-in steps. I think it would be better PR if we took it on ourselves to stop using them on someone else's property, unless we're 100% sure they're in a tree that wouldn't be devalued from a timber standpoint and the landowner has clearly said they don't mind.

Guys, can't....can't we all just get along...and call each other names, and use a little innuendo from time to time, and say things that make our wives smack us on the back of the head, and be hunters, and have well-thought-out answers, and not worry if sometimes someone brings up one subject, and that subject reminds somebody of something completely different, and that doesn't bother the original poster, cause that poster is not so uptight that they're freakin out if they brought up one subject, and that reminded somebody else of something completely different? Huh...Can't we?

One final point: This thread has been read over 1,000 times because it is INTERESTING and maybe even ENTERTAINING.

Richard

[Big58cal]

You know, after I got through Walt's post and then the first paragraph or two of rlb's, I had decided to call a halt to this thread and lock it. Then I read the rest of rlb's post.

He's right. For one, this thread has been off of the topic for so long, that it wouldn't matter if it got back on it or not. We all have to BS a little, as well as get a little "wound up" sometimes. Tell me a hunter that doesn't like to BS a little and I'll show you someone who is boring as all get out! This thread started out as just getting opinions on something, but then our "little buddies in Richmond" got involved and turned it into the "Jerry Springer" of threads ("I'm Sleeping With My Aunt, Who Loves The Paddlefish That The Governor Is In Bed With At Auxier Flats, Who Didn't Get Me A Job With F&W"). Personally, any posts that I see from our "little buddies" are going to be deleted on the spot if they are even the slightest bit off of the topic or even slightly start to insult or demean anyone. They're welcome to post, as long as it's something constructive to add to the discussion. I love a good discussion (or BS, whichever the case may be), as long as everyone has fun in it! [:D]

No sense in trying to get this topic back on the subject. Too far gone! Now, it's just for entertainment!

So who thinks rlb should open a shooting preserve on his land? [8D] How about shogan for our next president? [8D] I got a good one, Birdman being the posterchild for birth control!!!! [:D]

[Xtreme]

I say "here , here" Big! good post indeed. Especially the part about Shogan for our next president! One minute we would want to choke him the next we would want to hug him[:D]

As for rlb's shooting preserve the deer are so thick there that it would be like shooting fish in a barrel[:o)]

It appears that lunacy has run amok on this thread[8]

[INKYHUNTER]

I agree 100% RLB. Shogan for president, surely Big 58 you jest.[:D]

[ez]

mathmatics..........92 x 20 = 1840;... so; walt i think you are over counting the people that visit this site........each one of us that is posting and reading each others post and visiting just to see what the other has written justifies the amount of numbers and not actually how many are watching us.......1073 divided by 20 users =
53.63 hit per user........whoooooops ; another one off the subject.
oh by the way there walt.........congratulations on your kill......nice seeing you down on the farm........maybe see you there next weekend.........ez

[Walt K]

EZ, I appreciate the math class, I'm no genius ya know. Ok, Ok, I'll lighten up, BS'ing and ENTERTAINMENT, I can do that. Maybe I missed the whole CyberHunter point. Sorry.
It was nice to whack a big doe opening day though, hang in there EZ. :o) See ya on the farm.

[Duster]

ONE HUNDRED POST.....[:D]....Anyone care to try for Two...[}:)]..[:D][:p][:D]

[Ynothirekybiologists]

big58:

"This thread started out as just getting opinions on something, but then our "little buddies in Richmond" got involved and turned it into the "Jerry Springer" of threads ("I'm Sleeping With My Aunt,***(OH AND THAT STATEMENT IS NOT DEMEANING AND TRYING TO MAKE SOMEONE MAD?????)**** Who Loves The Paddlefish That The Governor Is In Bed With At Auxier Flats, Who Didn't Get Me A Job With F&W"). Personally, any posts that I see from our "little buddies" are going to be deleted on the spot if they are even the slightest bit off of the topic or even slightly start to insult or demean anyone. They're welcome to post, as long as it's something constructive to add to the discussion.

So you are gonna delete any of our posts that are off topic? and you try to say that is not censorship. we try not to demean anyone of you or hurt your feelings, just jogging up some ideas in your heads. if you can't see what we are saying, sorry you are being blind to some of the actions undertaken by your leaders in frankfort. BTW it just bothers you all that you have no idea who jimmy, and willie are. lighten up and remember bigcal :"We all have to BS a little, as well as get a little "wound up" sometimes."
Don't be a lemming!
maybe jimmy and willie should join your cyberhunters group so we feel part of your family?

[Multidigits]

Nobody cares who you and willie are, really....please accept that fact.

We as the Cyberhunter's are not at war with those in Frankfort. No, we don't agree with everthing that happens up there and have already been involved in some change coming from the top down. From what you post, you've not had any success getting what you want, with the methods you've decided to use.

You want change, your only hope at this point is to join Cyberhunter's. We will be glad to have you and willie and your uncle Ben as members. You will have to realize Rome wasn't built in a day, and things take time. You'll also have to know that you'll often be on the losing side of an argument. I know I often am, but over here, it's whay the majority want, not an individual.

If you want to join, you know how to send Big58 an email and you can get started.

[Ynothirekybiologists]

for your info, i have no idea who ben is! come on now, you know it is not what the majority wants in politics,hehe. i feel i have had success voicing opinions about departmental actions...not a single person mentioned it until jimmy spoke about the hiring process, it was obvious mr. darton had some problems with it and when jimmy brought it up on here, he had "good" discussion with grimes and gasett. kdfwr follows the day to day activies here, but are advised to stay out of it, and just watch. well kdfwr hope you watch and listen....many (not just jimmy, and willie) are not happy with the way stuff is done. so multi? how is the best way to change hiring process and the state register which goes unused in the hand selection of employees?
don't be a lemming.

[Multidigits]

I'm not too concerned aout the hiring process. I'll admit I'd prefered a home grown boy to be the deer coordinator. But that didn't happen. When Gassett was promoted to WD, it was in his job scope to pick who he wanted. As long as Dey is qualified, you don't have a leg to stand on trying to fight the process. Dey only going to do what Gassett wants him to do anyway, so were in the same boat that we were in before that process completed.

As for what the majority wants, that was in reference to "how Cyberhunter's operate", not Dept. action. The Dept. is different then dealing with elected officials. They are not reelected every 4 years. The only why to effect change is from the top. That would be elect a Republican Gov. and try and get some change in the Commission or in Tom Bennett's position, assuming change is needed. I'll reserve my opinion on that for now.

I know one way your not going to get change, and that's the way you've been trying to do it. Individuals will not be heard, at least very loudly. Strenght is in numbers and that's a goal of our Club.

Balls in your court, you going to join or not????

[Ynothirekybiologists]

multi: now question this, the postion for deer biologist had to be posted on the state website. as far as i know the position should have been filled with one of the top 5 candidates off the state register for wildlife biologist. was Day in those top 5? if not the state register is worthless, why should anyone of us recent grads go even take the test, all that proves is it is who you know. the position was also posted on texas a&m site which stated to send a resume to gasett, no mention of taking an exam. gasett when questioned on this stated this is the way i was hired. so the successful person, must be hand picked. once picked he/she will take the written exam to make sure they only pass it...their score is not stacked up against the state register. that is the way i see it is being run. anyone else have any ideas?

[Birdman]

Ynothireky you mit as well join and get your feet wet, what the hell. Are you a student at UK? The story I get when asking the question about why the dept. doesn't hire from with in the state, is that most of the teachers and students at our colleges are to GREEN, hell you don't sound green, are you, and are our colleges on the green side.

And I care who you are, hell I'd like to meet you. Are you from the mountains? If not you dawm sure sound like it.

[Ynothirekybiologists]

LOL
some of our wildlife professors in this state are some of the best. one reason i feel we have alot of greenies is because kdfwr has positions but come on now who can work for 9 months with no benefits especially insurance!, and low pay to gain experience? not I, my belly gets hungry for food and on a salary like that a person struggles to make ends meet. a B.S. in wildlife degree is worthless unless our state agencies stand up and find some funding for our upcoming biologists. i know budgets are tight but geez i see some good excess money being spent at central, hehehe. seriously what college grad wants to earn $8.75/hour and be seasonal for 5 years then just maybe, i mean maybe (right brian?) you might get selected to move up and become a biologist for the state and earn about $12/hour.

[Multidigits]

You should have known that going into school????? Didn't anyone tell you what you might expect???? You could have majored in egineering and went to a major chemical plant, worked 25 years and get cut with a 40% pension deduction. That's whats happening where I work, and at other places all over the country. There is no loyalty any more in the work palce. Everybody is now just a temporary employee, here to use at as little as the market dictates and then toss when it's time for a cheaper way to produce the product. Sorry about the triade but it's true. You need to accept the fact that you didn't get hired, and probably won't get hired in the future because you've made waves, and go from there. Sorry about your luck!

If you want to join, we might be able to work out a payment plan if you can't afford the $10.

[rlb165]

Rlb's shooting range? Deer so thick here its' like shooting fish in a barrel? At this time, I would like to request one of our OTHER moderators to delete any posts made by THESE moderators that promote the taking of deer on property owned by one rlb165.[:p]

Big58, no offense man, but every since we made fun of your archery-gun thing, you've been kinda cranky. Looky here folks, in case you haven't seen this thing.

http://swivelmachine.com/html/rimfire.htm

just kiddin'[8D][8D]

Multi, I'm really sorry about your job.

[Multidigits]

Well it ain't a crossbow so I guess you can use it????[}:)]

Need to kill more does anyway, right????[xx(][V]

[Multidigits]

I don't know what that has to do with screw in steps....but that pretty much is amazing! What's next?[?]

[shogan]

I just watched my API climbing stand video and they really bashed them screw in steps and even the use of strap ons. Their number 1 concern saftey of hunters.

[GSP]

The rifle / arrow shooter fits into this thread perfectly! You can shoot an arrow into a tree about every 24" and then climb up!
I'm all for it![?]

[Multidigits]

Looks a litle pricey though

[Big58cal]

So what's wrong with the gadget? It combines the best of both worlds! Wish I had the money for one. People combine hunts all the time (pheasant/deer, moose/caribou, elk/mule deer). So what's wrong with taking an extra barrel with you and going after deer and squirrels???[:D]

See there "little buddies", I haven't deleted any of your latest posts. It is possible to communicate with us "common people". Believe me, I know first hand about the KDFWR hiring policies! I got passed over for a F&W job also because I didn't have any ______ experience. The people with F&W knew that I knew _________, and they knew that he would give me a job if they didn't hire me, thus getting some _________ experience. Then, in a few years, they would hire me out from underneath him, because, after all, that was what I had gone to school for. Didn't quite work that way though. Somewhere along the way, after I was out of college, I got a brain and figured out that I was never going to get rich in F&W, and that I could make more money in the electronics industry. Among the pay, 401K, stocks, and bonuses, there's the insurance. It is better than what I had with the state, and cheaper! When the little man was born, there were complications, and he had to be taken by C-section. I got a statement from the hospital afterwards. It was over $10,000. There was a note at the bottom saying, "You are responsible for this amount: $2.25"! The insurance wouldn't cover the phone and TV in the room!!!! Anyway, I digress.......... Don't count on a Wildlife Mgmnt degree. That and 60 cents will get you a soft drink (or "Beast", in another case).

Point is, I don't agree with the F&W hiring process. I got bit by it also. I used to be bitter about it. Not anymore though. I realize that it was probably the best thing that could happen for me and my family that I DIDN'T get hired. A few bitter people aren't even going to get noticed when it comes to trying to correct this.

So who's up for a deer hunt on rlb's land? [:p] I hear that there's some good deer there! After all, it's in Harding Co. They're Zone 1.....Plenty of deer there! [}:)]

[shogan]

When I was a kid I always wanted to be a park ranger or kdfwr agent. Maybe when I retire I could get a job like that.

Also the API video said never use nails or home made steps or house hold ladders to climb a tree you need to buy their ladder.

[Duster]

Your not the only one who looked into an outdoor career Shogan. At one time I wanted to be a C.O.. Had a good friend of the familly that was a state trooper in high standings in the state. He was going to do all he could to help my dream come true. That was untill I found out how much money they had to exist on. Talk about a shock, I found several of the C.O.'s if they had a couple kids qualified for food stamps because they were under the poverty level in pay.

I see the problem the fellow on here complaining about not getting hired to his chosen vocation but like another here said he should have looked into the NEED for people in his chosen field before he made that choice. A degree in a field that has limited opportunities don't do much good when the job's are scarce. Politic's have always played a part in hireing for the state from toll collectors on the toll roads, the person who runs the garbage dump, to the highest non-elected position in the state. It's the same in every state not just Kentucky.