Gobbler to hen ratio is out of whack...

[massive horns]

The state should look into the ratios of hens to gobblers very soon. I have never seen so many hens with gobblers in the last 2 years. We try our best to control the hens in the fall but we barely scratch the surface the shear number we have around here...
Anyone else have this problem?

[turk2di]

There are 2 fall gun seasons that nobody takes advantage of. Much like killin does, it seems 2b less than macho for many hunters who even bother to go in the fall. Can't think of any other way than the harvest opportunity to thin them out. Frankly, i'd rather have too many hens than not enuf;)

[massive horns]

There are 2 fall gun seasons that nobody takes advantage of.

Let me re-iterate. We take full advantage of the fall season. We also have no qualms about taking does either. When you have 120 in a flock with 6 toms strutting, the numbers are way to high. 2 per hunter in the fall gun seasons is not going to make a dent. I agree with you though, there are not alot of hunters in the fall that take advantage of it.

[turk2di]

Let me re-iterate. We take full advantage of the fall season. We also have no qualms about taking does either. When you have 120 in a flock with 6 toms strutting, the numbers are way to high. 2 per hunter in the fall gun seasons is not going to make a dent. I agree with you though, there are not alot of hunters in the fall that take advantage of it.

Yea, i wasn't refering to you guy's in particular as u stated you try your best to control the hen population. Very few people gun hunt the fall birds & many that do won't kill a hen. Guess it not macho to kill one. Me, i'll bust a hen in a heartbest in the fall. The trigger pulls the same on them as a gobbler, just plain ole fun!

[massive horns]

Me, i'll bust a hen in a heartbest in the fall. The trigger pulls the same on them as a gobbler, just plain ole fun!

They also taste better if you ask me..

[skin_dog1]

No one manages turkeys like deer. I'd guess the surviaval rate of turkeys is so much lower than deer that managing them like deer could be very detrimental. I think turkey survival rate is like quail and only about 20%. Meaning we need alot more hens on the ground dropping birds so hunters have enough toms to hunt. Joe might be able to chime in with more realistic numbers, but you can't manage turkeys like deer.
Lets work the math,
your area has 20 hens 5 toms 10 jakes. All 5 toms get killed and 5 of the jakes get killed. next year you have 5 toms, plus the 20 hens each have 2 poults survive. Half of which are hens and half jakes. Now you have 5 toms, 60 hens and 40 jakes. All your toms get killed, half the jakes leaving 20 toms the next year, 120 hens and 60 jakes. See where I'm going with this. Even if you kill every single adult tom each year, you almost have to have an increase in overall flock. and the sex ratio gets better. Naturally, you'll only have as many birds as the land will support. Ma' nature doesn't care if toms or hens starve....

[Al]

There are 2 fall gun seasons that nobody takes advantage of.
Most people are focusing on deer in the fall.

[Luckybuck]

I wouldn't worry about the turkey population much as almost the entire flock rolls over within 4 years time and some seasons are going to be much better than others depending on mast, predation, weather, etc. if there wasn't much available food the weak ones would die off anyway.

[rcb216]

I agree with the above, I am mostly thinking about deer season and bow hunting, but if I get a hen in my bow range I'll give her an arrow two, just has'nt happenned in the last year or two.

[CSS archer]

There is a pretty high hen mortality, being that they are smaller and sit on the nest for 30 days. Lots of predators can take hens. Seems like the mortality study indicated that approximately 40% of hens die annually, thus the fall shotgun season would be insignificant.

A spring hen season would be stupid as they have made it to breed and their clutch is important for following years. Most nests get broken up by nest predators like coons and possums, so every hen is important.

If you see large groups of hens like 120 this time of year, thats wierd? You may have a fall/winter group that large that may have come from 10 miles away and spread back out as nesting is initiated.

Every cluth hatches at basically a 1:1 ratio, so a good year the hen/poult ratio is 1:3, 10 hens produce 30 young (average) 15 of those are male.

If you truly have a 20:1 hen to gob ratio, then your problem is likely poaching.

[skin_dog1]

Thanks Joe. I knew you would know the science behind it.

[massive horns]

A spring hen season would be stupid as they have made it to breed and their clutch is important for following years. Most nests get broken up by nest predators like coons and possums, so every hen is important.

If you see large groups of hens like 120 this time of year, thats wierd? You may have a fall/winter group that large that may have come from 10 miles away and spread back out as nesting is initiated.

Every cluth hatches at basically a 1:1 ratio, so a good year the hen/poult ratio is 1:3, 10 hens produce 30 young (average) 15 of those are male.

If you truly have a 20:1 hen to gob ratio, then your problem is likely poaching.

I agree with not having a spring hen season. Not saying that. Possibly increase the fall season a bit or increase the limit of hen harvest.

The group of 120 had 6 gobblers and the rest hens. I have a pic of 64 turkeys behind my house with 4 gobblers in it. Its not poaching. We have an abundance of food and water, and a large number of poults survive. More than average.

[raktrakr]

I'm hearing " too hot" and "dont want to mess with a bird full of mites" which pretty much translates into "hens aint worth it" just like the does

[Valley Station]

Too many hens is like having to much money.
If you have that gobbler to hen ratio sounds likes local toms being shot illegally.
You may have a local poacher shootin mostly toms over corn thru the winter.
Sounds like "feathered rat mentality at the corn feeders" justifying poaching.
With "new recruitement" of 2-year old birds each year should be seeing more toms.
Good luck in stopping the poacher.