Springfield 1911 45 ACP Question

[Jman]

I'm hearing both sides of it. With a round in the barrel and the hammer down, can the gun discharge if it sustains a blow to the back of the hammer? I'm told the older SA 1911's can but the newer ones will not. Can anyone give me a logical/accurate answer? (S.N. #N3275XX)

I'm a little uneasy carrying with hammer back/safety up. For the time being I'm carrying "hammer down" and "chamber empty".

Any advice/opinions welcome (with exceptions to replacing it with a Glock :) )

[trust me]

Cocked and locked is very safe, the only safe way to carry with a round in the chamber. To have an inadvertent discharge, you would have to kick the safety off, depress the grip safety, and pull the trigger. That sure isn't likely to happen accidently with a 1911.

Hammer down on a live round is bad news. The safety lever is not locking the firing pin and a drop or an impact could bounce the firing pin into the primer.

There isn't much need to walk around with a round chambered anyway, unless you are a cop or expecting to repel bad guys at any moment.

When I carry my 1911 it is with an empty chamber and cycling the slide only takes a second, if I ever needed to fire quickly. If I felt the need to fire quickly might arise, (it hasn't yet) then it will already be cocked and locked.

[Jman]

I appreciate the comment. Just last week I was in a gun store in a neighboring county and was advised that the later SA 1911's would not fire under these circumstances. I was advised that there is a mechanism inside the firearm preventing pressure from hitting the pin unless fully cocked and released by the trigger. I question the authenticity of this advice, thus the reason for my post/question.

Thanks again.

[trust me]

I won't say anything definitely cause I'm not an expert, but on the 70 and 80 series, I'm pretty confident I'm right.

[WhiteRubi]

I can't answer your question but I can give some friendly advice.

An empty chamber will get you killed. With all due respect Trust Me, I wouldn't think of carrying a gun without one in the chamber. I've read plenty and been in some classes that would surprise you.

In short, a study was done and someone with a knife, stick, etc at 21 feet away can attack you before you can unholster your gun. With an empty chamber, you stack the odds in their favor even more.

So, a 1911, in my opinion, should be carried cocked, locked, and ready to rock. ;)

[trust me]

I won't dispute your view, Rubi. I guess I lead a dull, uneventful life. I've never been in a position to draw on anyone for any reason. I hope my boring lifestyle continues to keep me alive and safe for many years to come.

I know it can happen. I have family members that have fired shots in defense of themselves, and once merely the sight of my brother's nickel-plated Python made everyone suddenly friendly and agreeable. It's just never happened to me.

All the holster carry I've ever done was to and from the range, or while idling away the day in the woods or on the water.

As I said earlier, if you are a cop or civilian in a bad position, cocked and locked is a very safe and very fast way to get your 1911 into play. A lot of unknowledgable folks will recoil in horror when they see that hammer back, but they're ignorant of the gun and its features. A 1911 is a very safe firearm.

[WhiteRubi]

I won't dispute your view, Rubi. I guess I lead a dull, uneventful life. I've never been in a position to draw on anyone for any reason. I hope my boring lifestyle continues to keep me alive and safe for many years to come.

I know it can happen. I have family members that have fired shots in defense of themselves, and once merely the sight of my brother's nickel-plated Python made everyone suddenly friendly and agreeable. It's just never happened to me.

All the holster carry I've ever done was to and from the range, or while idling away the day in the woods or on the water.

As I said earlier, if you are a cop or civilian in a bad position, cocked and locked is a very safe and very fast way to get your 1911 into play. A lot of unknowledgable folks will recoil in horror when they see that hammer back, but they're ignorant of the gun and its features. A 1911 is a very safe firearm.

I can see your point but it only takes one time of you not being "ready". It's a scarey place out there. A day doesn't go by that you don't read about a murder, robbery, or other violent crime. This is even more evident in the bigger cities, i.e. Lexington, The 'Ville, etc
I hope that you and I never get forced into a situation where we have to make that decision...unfortunately, you never know.

[skeeter]

When you cocke :eek: they STOP I think thats a good worning

[newshooter05]

i agree that cocked and locked is a good way to carry . if u think about it every gun with the hammer internally is cocked and locked and do not have grip safety. so if all guns except exposed hammer ones can be carried safely with the hammer back then i suppose the 1911 is the safest of them all because of the grip safety. hope i make sense.
david.

[Jman]

My holster raises some concern. Normally, when carrying with the hammer down, I loop the strap behind the hammer. If carrying with the hammer back (cocked), the strap can only go underneath the beaver tail on the back of the grip thus rendering that safety function useless. However, I still have the thumb safety to rely on as well as the trigger being completely concealed when carrying.

I guess carrying it "cocked and locked" is no different or any more dangerous than carrying any hammerless pistol equipped with a button safety.

[moreammoplz]

If it is a 70 series then maybe it will go off, that is why they came out with the series 80 Colt. The series 80 has a firing pin block.

You can tell which one yours is by looking under your slide. If you see a small round button looking thing you have a Series 80 gun.

[Jman]

Does that apply to a Colt only, or is that part applicable to the Springfield 1911 as well?

[moreammoplz]

I believe Colt was the first to come out with the firing pin block and named it the Series 80. I am pretty sure there are other manufactures making copies of the Series 80 design.

That being said, I just picked up a Springfield with the 3 dot sights (GI or Milspec can't remember which model) and noticed it was a copy of the Series 70. (No block) I also have a Rock Island Armory 1911 and it is a Series 70 also.

[Jman]

Moreammoplz,
I'm thinking that I have the likeness of the series 70 as well. I'm seeing nothing on my 1911 that would indicate otherwise.

Have you shot your Springfield off the bench? If so can you advise as to what kind of groups you have obtained? It would be nice to know if I have reached the gun's potential or if I just don't have what it takes. I'm a little disappointed with my results thus far.

[moreammoplz]

This is what a Series 70 looks like. Where the Q tip is pointing you would see a button if it as a Series 80.

My gun shoots about 3 inch groups off hand. I really like my Springfield, my next 1911 will be a Kimber Custom II though.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v702/moreammoplz/DSC04931.jpg


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v702/moreammoplz/DSC04929.jpg

[Jman]

Moreammoplz,
Thank you for the pics. I checked mine out and I definitely don't have the button. I appreciate the information.(nice 1911 BTW)

Good luck on the Kimber. Still a little pricey for me.

[turkeytalker]

From a self defense standpoint cocked and locked is the only way to carry!Anything that would give you enough time to cycle a round would give you enough time to retreat,it WILL be brought up in court.


You're at a stop light with your window rolled down,normal working day trying not to take a much needed nap before the green light strikes,when up walks an elderly looking man up to you'r window and shoves a knife to you'r throat and orders your car and money.

Option #1 Do as he says


Option#2 Grab your gun and put one in the chamber


Option#3 Fend off knife with one hand,while grabbing gun with other.Drop safeties,point,any questions?



A man can't go racking the slide everytime a vagrant walks up to their window.I was always told that an unloaded gun will get you killed,and of course that serves two truths

[Jman]

I tend to agree with TrustMe. I think I'll continue to carry without one in the barrel. I guess I just can't develop the fear of attack enough to carry it cocked. I fear and accidental discharge on any gun way more than an attack of some type.

[WhiteRubi]

I tend to agree with TrustMe. I think I'll continue to carry without one in the barrel. I guess I just can't develop the fear of attack enough to carry it cocked. I fear and accidental discharge on any gun way more than an attack of some type.


I hope that works out for you guys. In my opinion, I would rather carry nothing than carry a gun without one ready to go. To quote the post above
From a self defense standpoint cocked and locked is the only way to carry!Anything that would give you enough time to cycle a round would give you enough time to retreat,it WILL be brought up in court.

[trust me]

Guys, my viewpoint is from a lifetime of never needing a gun for self defense. I've been in places I thought it might be needed, and I guarantee you, those times saw me with a cocked and locked Colt either on my belt or in my armpit. Luckily, it never was needed.

There are lots of times I carry with nary a thought of a bad guy. But if I think the boogerman is close, there's one in the chamber.

[tinpoint]

cocked and locked is the only way I carry mine for protection,if your just going out to target shoot,carry it with an empty chamber,but as protecetion goes,an empty chamber will get you in trouble

[joehammer75]

John Moses Browning intended for his 1911 to be carried cocked and locked, providing one does not pin the grip safty its a safe way to carry.
the 70s are less safe to carry with a hammer down on a loaded chamber then a 80.
I have always carried cocked and locked and still got all me toes :-)

[trust me]

I am with trust me on this too . cocked and locked on a 1911 is like haveing a lit match in one hand and pouring gas out of the other .

Hmmm...I never said that. A 1911 is very safe while cocked and locked. I trust the gun implicitly; it's me and everybody else I have questions about.

Again, if I think I'm in a dangerous place or situation, it will be cocked and locked. Otherwise, it won't be. I don't find myself in very many dangerous situations, thankfully.

[kycowboy]

IMO a unloaded gun is nothing but a club :eek: