Have you ever agree with the anti-hunter agenda???

[Multidigits]

Check these out and see how you stand......from the HSUS website. Do we need to make a deal and give some of these up to save the whole or work for some of the types of hunting that others do that we don't agree with?????

"The HSUS Hunting Campaign works to end the most egregious forms of hunting that exist today. Our highest priority projects put these examples of truly unsporting behavior in the crosshairs."

Internet Hunting

Internet hunting, also called remote-controlled hunting, uses internet technology to allow a computer user to aim and fire a weapon, mounted on a mechanized tripod, to kill captive wildlife from hundreds or even thousands of miles away.

Canned Hunting

A signature campaign and a top priority for The HSUS, StopCannedHunts.org focuses on banning canned hunts, where captive, often tame, hand-reared animals are shot within fenced enclosures at close range. They are often exotic animals like addax, blackbuck and oryx, sometimes obtained from roadside circuses and zoos. Twenty states have banned canned hunts.

Contest Kills

Contest kills are an activity where animals, usually coyotes or prairie dogs, are shot by contestants for prizes or money. The shooter who can shoot the most or heaviest animals is declared the winner. The Hunting Campaign seeks to stop contest kills wherever they occur.

Live Pigeon Shoots

Pigeon shoots are a type of contest kill in which participants kill thousands of animals for prizes and cash. The birds are shot from 30 yards away, with most birds wounded and suffering for an unknown stretch of time rather than killed outright. Pigeon shoots are illegal in nearly every state, and the Hunting Campaign is working to ban the few live pigeon shoots remaining.

Targeting Children

The number of hunters in this country is declining and so is hunting, leaving promoters scrambling for ways to keep this $20-billion-a-year industry profitable. Their solution is recruiting children by lowering or eliminating minimum hunting ages and exempting children from hunter safety courses. The HSUS opposes such actions because they place children in unnecessary danger and teach them that animals are nothing more than live targets.

Bear Baiting

Many hunters attract bears to an area by luring them with piles of jelly donuts and rotting meat. While the bear feeds, the hunter sits in a nearby tree stand or blind and shoots the unsuspecting animal. Of the 28 states that allow bear hunting, 18 prohibit the baiting of bears.

Hound Hunting

Many hunters chase bears, bobcats and mountain lions until they can be treed or cornered using packs of dogs. The dogs' collars are fitted with radio transmitters so all the hunter must do is follow the signal, then shoot the trapped animal down from the tree at point-blank range. Training exercises often involve hunters allowing their dogs to rip apart baby animals so that the dogs develop a taste for blood.

Field Coursing

Dogs are used to chase rabbits, foxes and other animals in competitions. When the dogs catch their quarry they often fight over the terrified animal, sometimes literally tearing him apart. Even if the animal is not caught, he may later die due to the fear and stress associated with the chase.

The World Hunting Association

In one of the most absurd and cruel "reality" shows ever created, The World Hunting Association has mixed the unfair chase and drive-thru killing of a canned hunt with the tournament-style competition and commercialization of a contest kill.

Sunday Hunting

A number of states prohibit or restrict hunting on Sundays. Because hunters have six days a week to themselves in the woods, this break from hunting allows other outdoor enthusiasts, as well as animals, a day of safety and quiet. We encourage states to maintain these restrictions.

[Art]

I'm against internet hunting and canned hunts probably as much as the HSUS is if not more. My reasoning is because it's not hunting, it's just pathetic.
How hard is it to shoot someones pet?

I also believe that it is these fringe types of "hunting" that do the actual harm to traditional hunting in the eyes of the non-hunting public.

If the question is- Would I support the HSUS if a deal was struck that we would help them eliminate these types of hunting if they agreed to leave traditional hunting alone? You bet your ass I would. My only problem would be that how do we know we could trust them to keep their end of the bargain with so many radical elements in their organization? Kind of like a wolf in sheeps clothing or a trojan horse type deal.

[quackrstackr]

You can't pluck a diamond from a pile of manure without getting yourself covered in **** and they know that.

You can tell by the wording of it that their ultimate goal is the end of all hunting, they just have it somewhat sugar coated so it goes down easier to those that would may be riding the fence and can't pick it out.

That's like these countries that have given up their gun rights one weapon at a time until they're just left with a rock and a nice pointy stick.

There is no end to it but to think otherwise is exactly what they want.

[cephus]

You can't pluck a diamond from a pile of manure without getting yourself covered in **** and they know that.

You can tell by the wording of it that their ultimate goal is the end of all hunting, they just have it somewhat sugar coated so it goes down easier to those that would may be riding the fence and can't pick it out.

That's like these countries that have given up their gun rights one weapon at a time until they're just left with a rock and a nice pointy stick.

There is no end to it but to think otherwise is exactly what they want.

Exactly. I despise the idea of canned hunts and internet hunting. BUT I will never join forces or agree to anything from PETA or HSUS.

[Multidigits]

I wouldn't say never, because most already have joined in--be it canned hunting such as the released duck shoots or the Beller taped hunt or the Internet hunting or the World Hunting deal that just came up or maybe even something as simple as a crossbow expansion or leg hold traps or any one of the other zillion things about hunting that you personally don't approve of.

HSUS has us by the b_ _ _ _ on this one. Like it or not, we are our own worst enemy when it comes to picking and choosing how we hunt.

ex. - Public outcry prompted the Commission to outlaw Internet hunting in our state and most others. Not public outcry by the anti's but hunters themselves.

[trust me]

It never hurts to responsibly police ourselves as hunters. The fact that a few points may coincide with the HSUS agenda is irrelevant. We don't need them to regulate us or our sport. We can do it well ourselves.

The goal of HSUS to stop education of children about hunting gives you a peephole into the HSUS ultimate goal of banning hunting outright. They know that can't do it all at once but they know that they can chip away one issue at a time, whether it be dogs in Louisville or hunting on Sundays, and in a few years they may see their goal in reach.

[huntr467]

Ol bait and switch.....They being PETA and HSUS would love to get "real- honest- ethical" sportsman in their ranks, for the sake of banning certain types of activities that those sportsman don't approve of anyway.
They can't beat us so they will try to join us by fighting the things we or the general public don't want either.
They are bad news either way....I would NEVER join them to do a job that we as sportsman should be able to do on our own.
There are many other ways to protect our sport than joining one enemy to fight another.
Just like all the bickering on this site about type of weapons and baiting and overharvest...those are the things they love to see. Then they can recruit the bowhunters to fight the gunhunters and the nonbaiters to fight the baiters etc. etc.
Baby steps... thats what they are about unitl their goal of the END OF ALL HUNTING is accomplished.
They are the big bad wolf in this fairy tale. Just my .02 worth.

[Multidigits]

You make a good point about the Louisville dog issue. Like it or not, the public generally supports most of the ordinance and recognizes the need to have some protection from dangerous dogs. IF hunting or the right to hunt or any of those issues that HSUS are pushing were to ever become ballot issues in Louisville or statewide, most of those residents of the metro area are going to see who worked against a measure that they approved of and generally supported and pull the lever against those they might disagree with. In that case, it would be another loser for the hunters.

[Bray]

[/QUOTE]Field Coursing

Dogs are used to chase rabbits, foxes and other animals in competitions. When the dogs catch their quarry they often fight over the terrified animal, sometimes literally tearing him apart. Even if the animal is not caught, he may later die due to the fear and stress associated with the chase..

Well let's just hire them some therapist and prescribe them some prozac. I mean give me a break. These people want to give these animals human charactoristics. Somehow I doubt that a rabbit is going to just up and die after it escapes a fox or a beagle.


Sunday Hunting

A number of states prohibit or restrict hunting on Sundays. Because hunters have six days a week to themselves in the woods, this break from hunting allows other outdoor enthusiasts, as well as animals, a day of safety and quiet. We encourage states to maintain these restrictions

This proves to me that the HSUS would eliminate all forms of hunting if it could. Sure I may not agree with some of the items on their "list" but I am not going to support their agenda either. To each his own.

[KYCatBirdHunter]

this goes back to the old mind your own business issue. Yeah, I don't like canned hunts, I don't like internet hunting, I don't do competitions. However I know that there are people out there that enjoy it, and bottom line is that animals are not people. As long as someone eats the critter I don't see the problem.

I know, let's arrest every coyote we see because of all the terror that it has undoubtedly inflicted on rabbits before eating them. PETA, and the HSUS just need take their bleeding hearts somewhere else.

[Swampthing]

Give them an inch and they will take a mile.

[Al]

this goes back to the old mind your own business issue.
I dissagree we can not "mind our own business."
If it is hunting related it IS our business and we need to police ourselves.
If we are irresponsible and do not mind our own business then some else will do it for us.

[Duster]

I been saying this for a long time. I don't care if you hunt high fence, hunt from 1000 miles away, hunt on Sunday, Bait for bears, hunt with a crossbow or whatever as long as it is legal. When the time comes to defend hunting I want those people on my side both with $$ and votes.

[MsgMills]

I say if you hunt the animal, eat it or make sure you give the meat to someone who will eat the meat. Being another hunter, the Feed the Homless Program or whatever it is. But don't just shoot the animal and take picture's and that's it.... Don't waste the animal.....

[Al]

Id get in bed with the high fence operators to fight the HSUS, but Ill never get in bed with the HSUS to fight against anything.

[ryan hickey]

I say if you hunt the animal, eat it or make sure you give the meat to someone who will eat the meat. Being another hunter, the Feed the Homless Program or whatever it is. But don't just shoot the animal and take picture's and that's it.... Don't waste the animal.....


although i happen to agree with u here, u HAVE to be careful on this issue. i mean, should i not shoot a coyote cause i won't eat it? what about bowfishing? never been but it looks like alot of fun - at least alot more fun than actually eating a carp...:D

bottom line here sarge, SOME animals need to be 'wasted'....

[maxcam]

You make a good point about the Louisville dog issue. Like it or not, the public generally supports most of the ordinance and recognizes the need to have some protection from dangerous dogs. IF hunting or the right to hunt or any of those issues that HSUS are pushing were to ever become ballot issues in Louisville or statewide, most of those residents of the metro area are going to see who worked against a measure that they approved of and generally supported and pull the lever against those they might disagree with. In that case, it would be another loser for the hunters.

Tom you keep stepping into an arena you know absolutely nothing about......You should try and watch the counsil meetings on TV and keep up to date on whats going on......The latest move by the Democratic Caucus was to try and undo then redo what was illegally done in December....Thats kinda like trying to call the bullet back after its left the gun ......They know they are going to loose the lawsuit and are more concerned about saving face than to retract this horrible piece of legislation. One counsil member put it ...." not only are we the laughing stock of the state but in many corners of the nation...."

As for your statement that the majority want this ordinance as is.....A second lawsuit was files late last week.......The first lawsuit had two plantiffs.....This one has 13.......

On another note.....Peppers Tackle and Hooters filed a lawsuit against the Metro Counsil over an ordinance that was passed concerning signs......Their lawyers used a major portion of the lawsuit that the LKS and LKS filed against the metro counsil in their suit as well.......

The latest lawsuit filed has been reviewed by the legal community here in Louisville as one of the best written lawsuits ever submitted concerning civil rights.......Seems that our distinguished friend and Duke graduate is a mighty fine attorney.......Im sure he can speak to the particulars of the suit if you need to have it spelled out but the gest of it is this.......There are several state and federal violations of constitutional rights being violated by this ordinance in our opinion.......Now how many folks besides yourself do you think are going to support that?

In California a piece of legislation was introduced and passed to mandate spay and neutering of all dogs at 4 months of age........That is how the HSUS goes about ending sport hunting Tom......One pebble at a time!

http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/pub/07-08/bill/asm/ab_1601-1650/ab_1634_bill_20070223_introduced.html

http://www.hsus.org/legislation_laws/state_legislation/california/ab1634_california_healthy_pets_act.html

If you take the time to read the law there is no exemption for a hunting dog unless it is registered with recognized organization like the AKC or UKC. Now how many hunters do you know that give a rats behind about AKC registration?

If you notice on the USSA website there is now a legal defense fund set up to help fight the attacks going on around the country that are being waged by groups like the HSUS against sporting dogs. This was done shortly after we filed the first lawsuit..........

Mostly and generally are fairly broad statements......When you say the general public mostly supports this ordinance could you please post up what facts you base this statement on.......I would also like for you to point out what parts you feel they support......

[cephus]

Id get in bed with the high fence operators to fight the HSUS, but Ill never get in bed with the HSUS to fight against anything.

Makes 2 of us.

[maxcam]

although i happen to agree with u here, u HAVE to be careful on this issue. i mean, should i not shoot a coyote cause i won't eat it? what about bowfishing? never been but it looks like alot of fun - at least alot more fun than actually eating a carp...:D

bottom line here sarge, SOME animals need to be 'wasted'....

There are folks that use rough fish to feed birds of prey that they are rehabing if Im not mistaken......Give them a call and see if you can give them a hand.......

[eddiejohn4]

Hunting is in our souls, from the very first steps on this planet we as man have hunted.

Allowing the misinformed and misguided a foot hold on us is a mistake. I do not care why you hunt how you hunt where you hunt as long as it is legal and done humanely I have no say at all. If a man wants to pay 10,000 dollars to kill his meat then by all means have at it. we pay every day at the grocery store. the only difference is that when we shop we do not have to kill ourselfs. I feel this is a mistake and is what leads to the removal from nature and mans role therein.

We have entertained some of these misguided people and allowed them to think that they can be the norm that we hunters torture our prey. and that somehow hunting is against nature when truly just the oppisite is true.

Most of these animal activists have no clue on the foot print they leave on this planet. They think because they eat vegetables that they kill not. How wrong they are as all men and women effect their biosphere. when you plant a crop you have to clear the land which in turn kills ground dwelling animals. when you clear a forest to plant a crop you kill. when you use toilett paper to wipe your bottom you have killed an animal.
Take a picture ,where does the emultion come from? you guessed it an animal ( cows.)

We need to teach our children instead of letting them hear falsehoods comming from these pseudo intellectuals. Who truly have forgotten what nature is really about.

I hate to keep preaching this, but we need to go on the offensive as these groups are attacking our children with books and litature in our own schools.

[ryan hickey]

There are folks that use rough fish to feed birds of prey that they are rehabing if Im not mistaken......Give them a call and see if you can give them a hand.......



was merely trying to make a point here, as good as it sounds to say 'don't kill it if u ain't gonna eat it', its not always correct. got any ideas what to do w/ coyotes?:)

[ceg4uk]

There are several state and federal violations of constitutional rights being violated by this ordinance in our opinion.......Now how many folks besides yourself do you think are going to support that?

I think a lot of people are going to support it, unfortunately. Those crafty politicians and pundits use fear to cajole the ignorant masses to give up some of their constitutional rights in exchange for so-called "safety." Just look at all of the constitutional freedoms we have lost since 9/11.

[maxcam]

I think a lot of people are going to support it, unfortunately. Those crafty politicians and pundits use fear to cajole the ignorant masses to give up some of their constitutional rights in exchange for so-called "safety." Just look at all of the constitutional freedoms we have lost since 9/11.

Just got a call from a woman that has to retriever mixes one altered the other unaltered......both were house kept dogs that she walks daily.....they got out of her home and before she could get them back in the house they were picked up by animal control......Its going to cost her over $500 dollars to get them back or they are going to uthanize the animals......This is her first offense and she is a retired elderly lady so these are her companions.......Do you think she is now educated?

Heres another of example of many phone calls we are getting......There have been several folks that have called us after recieving complaints about getting citations in the mail for having unaltered dogs contained by a hidden fence.......The problem is these dogs are altered......Metro Animal Services is riding around writing tickets without investigating to see if the dog is altered and saying that once they are in the system then they wont be getting a ticket......Problem is that the people getting ticketed have to load up their dog and take it to MAS to get it "inspected" to resolve the ticket.........

This law is ambiguous and selectively enforced......

As to your charge that politicians can do as they darn well pleas.....That is only correct if we do not stand up for our constitutional rights......That is what the League of Kentucky Sportsmen is doing along with several other organizations and individuals........

[Bray]

was merely trying to make a point here, as good as it sounds to say 'don't kill it if u ain't gonna eat it', its not always correct. got any ideas what to do w/ coyotes?:)

What was it that Clint Eastwood said, "The birds gotta eat the same as the worms."

[Multidigits]

I'm not an expert on the Constitution, but have scanned over it a tme or two.....don't remember seeing anything in there about dog ownership????

[WBBP]

Max, sounds like the woman shouldn't of let her dogs get loose for several days. Bet she will be more careful in the future after she pays her fine.

I wondered if she would have still called you if her dogs would have mauled a kid at the local playground :confused: If she is too old to control her dogs, maybe she shouldn't have dogs.

Lost in all this hoopla is that the original dog ordinance was probably not being enforced.

K

[maxcam]

I'm not an expert on the Constitution, but have scanned over it a tme or two.....don't remember seeing anything in there about dog ownership????

Maybe you should reread it and pay a little closer attention to what it says......While you are at it be sure and read the Kentucky Constitution as well.....

IT is our belief that the ordinance violates our 1st and 14th amendment rights as well as the commerce clause of the US Constitution as well as Sections 1,2, and 3 of the Kentucky State Constitution as well as one or more existing state statutory laws......

[maxcam]

Max, sounds like the woman shouldn't of let her dogs get loose for several days. Bet she will be more careful in the future after she pays her fine.

I wondered if she would have still called you if her dogs would have mauled a kid at the local playground :confused: If she is too old to control her dogs, maybe she shouldn't have dogs.

Lost in all this hoopla is that the original dog ordinance was probably not being enforced.

K

And what if she cant afford to pay her fine? Does she deserve to loose her pets because a repair man left a door open while he was goin in and out of her residence?

[WBBP]

She needs to take that up with the repair man who supposedly let her dogs out. She also should have taken proper precautions to avoid such a situation.

The kids or neighbors that could have gotten mauled won't care who let the dogs out.

Max, you know that I don't support the ordinance, but why do you and others want to make excuses for pet owners. Pet owners need to control their friggin pets at all times, if they can't they shouldn't have them.

If pet owners would take care of their pets in an intelligent way, we wouldn't be having this discussion.

[maxcam]

She needs to take that up with the repair man who supposedly let her dogs out. She also should have taken proper precautions to avoid such a situation.

The kids or neighbors that could have gotten mauled won't care who let the dogs out.

Max, you know that I don't support the ordinance, but why do you and others want to make excuses for pet owners. Pet owners need to control their friggin pets at all times, if they can't they shouldn't have them.

If pet owners would take care of their pets in an intelligent way, we wouldn't be having this discussion.

Im not making excuses for anyone......Where is this ladies right to due process......Where is her right and freedom of personal property ownership.......The largest portions of her fines stem from one of the dogs which is 11 years old not being spayed........Why should she spay a dog that she may not want spayed for what ever reason.....There might be a health issue involved with the dog......There is no scientific evidence that says an unaltered dog is less agressive than an altered dog.....In fact most attack dogs used by the US military and local law enforcement are spayed or neutered......

I dont have a problem with laws as long as they are constitutional and this one is far from that......

[WBBP]

Max, I could ask the same questions in reverse. The publics right to not be attacked by loose dogs outweighs her rights to own the dogs. When it comes to protecting the public, I don't give a xxxx about anyone's dogs-when did a pet and pet owner get superior personal property rights?

It seems like you are always defending the irresponsible pet owner instead of the vicitms or potential victims. I don't like the new ordinance and it won't solve the problems you have in Jefferson County, people taking care of their pets will solve the problem though.

If the lady was more responsible, we wouldn't be having this discussion. Her dogs roamed the neighborhood and got picked up by animal control. She needs to pay up or shut up.

Maybe she needs to hire a more responsible repair man.

K

[maxcam]

Max, I could ask the same questions in reverse. The publics right to not be attacked by loose dogs outweighs her rights to own the dogs. When it comes to protecting the public, I don't give a xxxx about anyone's dogs-when did a pet and pet owner get superior personal property rights?

It seems like you are always defending the irresponsible pet owner instead of the vicitms or potential victims. I don't like the new ordinance and it won't solve the problems you have in Jefferson County, people taking care of their pets will solve the problem though.

If the lady was more responsible, we wouldn't be having this discussion. Her dogs roamed the neighborhood and got picked up by animal control. She needs to pay up or shut up.

Maybe she needs to hire a more responsible repair man.

K

You keep talking about potential scenarios.......The very same arguements you are using could apply to gun ownership.....Where is your stance on that......? Are guns with bullets going to require the owner to buy a special license? Are rifles going to be labeled more dangerous than shot guns?

Kalen you need to look around the state....Louisville isnt the only place this happening.....The HSUS is working in every corner of this state and have even infiltrated the Kentucky Farm Bureau......Now how long before we see lobbying in Frankfort against hunting from KFB? They played a big part in the drafting of this law so dont think they wont be pushing their luck in the near future!

Given the record of some folks in the legislature I am very concerned!

[Multidigits]

Maybe you should reread it and pay a little closer attention to what it says......While you are at it be sure and read the Kentucky Constitution as well.....

IT is our belief that the ordinance violates our 1st and 14th amendment rights as well as the commerce clause of the US Constitution as well as Sections 1,2, and 3 of the Kentucky State Constitution as well as one or more existing state statutory laws......


Just did a quick search....no DOG in it anywhere. Keeping a dangerous dog is not a right guaranteed by that document.

[Multidigits]

And what if she cant afford to pay her fine? Does she deserve to loose her pets because a repair man left a door open while he was goin in and out of her residence?


Everybody can afford it.....$2 a day served. Sounds like your making it up about the repairman. why don't you chip in and help her pay up???

[Multidigits]

"Where is this ladies right to due process" She'll get her day in court....due process. Got to go, the dog needs to go out and pee.

[Feedman]

I have been finding cat crap on my porch!! Someone in my neighborhood is going to lose a cat. It is not my fault that they let their cats roam around free all the time. I can be responsible for my porch and will take the necessary action to stop this problem.:mad: :mad: :mad:

[maxcam]

"Where is this ladies right to due process" She'll get her day in court....due process. Got to go, the dog needs to go out and pee.

Ill take our attorney's opinion over yours Tom......Stick to driving the dozer!

[maxcam]

Everybody can afford it.....$2 a day served. Sounds like your making it up about the repairman. why don't you chip in and help her pay up???


The fine is over $500 bucks and Im not making up anything......By the way did you get those figures that prove the majority of Louisville is in support of this ordinance? If you call Cornell Im sure youll get what you are looking for.......Enjoy your visit with your pooch.....

[Multidigits]

The fine is over $500 bucks and Im not making up anything......By the way did you get those figures that prove the majority of Louisville is in support of this ordinance? If you call Cornell Im sure youll get what you are looking for.......Enjoy your visit with your pooch.....


Here's how those thing work......there's a deal that happens ever so often that's called an election. Sometimes, people like those that sit on the Metro Council run for election and they either win or lose based on the number of votes they get or don't get. In this case, those that voted this ord. in got more votes than the folks that didn't vote the ord. in. So happens that most of the council are from a particular party that favors this ord. because they want to win the next election too. The people demanded that something be done about dangerous and nusaince dogs and pets and they got what they want. The last mention of the ord, in the Lou. paper mention the oppisition force that showed up to object to the repassing--5 total with I love pet stickers. Probably all rode together in the same car. If you could get them each to throw in a c spot a piece, they could pay this poor ladies fine.

[maxcam]

The time for talk and negotiations are over Tom. There is no need to be lied to once again. Ive participated in those discussions many many times over the last year and they are going to do what a certain subgroup of the democratic caucus wants them to do...

There is a substantial number of plantiffs that have filed two lawsuits against the ordinance and we shall see who is right and who is wrong.......If they thought they could win on this issue why didnt they vote on it before the elections a month earlier....They had the majority at that time as well......

[Multidigits]

The time for talk and negotiations are over Tom. There is no need to be lied to once again. Ive participated in those discussions many many times over the last year and they are going to do what a certain subgroup of the democratic caucus wants them to do...

There is a substantial number of plantiffs that have filed two lawsuits against the ordinance and we shall see who is right and who is wrong.......If they thought they could win on this issue why didnt they vote on it before the elections a month earlier....They had the majority at that time as well......

The ord. will stand, mostly in the current state. The majority demands it. That happens to be a democrate majority, being that Louisville is a democratic strong hold. Nothing new here.

[Bray]

Here's how those thing work......there's a deal that happens ever so often that's called an election. Sometimes, people like those that sit on the Metro Council run for election and they either win or lose based on the number of votes they get or don't get. In this case, those that voted this ord. in got more votes than the folks that didn't vote the ord. in. So happens that most of the council are from a particular party that favors this ord. because they want to win the next election too. The people demanded that something be done about dangerous and nusaince dogs and pets and they got what they want. The last mention of the ord, in the Lou. paper mention the oppisition force that showed up to object to the repassing--5 total with I love pet stickers. Probably all rode together in the same car. If you could get them each to throw in a c spot a piece, they could pay this poor ladies fine.

WHOA, you mean to tell me that the democrats were elected this past elections becuase of an HSUS ordinance. I'm sure that it didn't have anything to do with the war in Iraq, president Bush, or disdain for the republican party in general. Not to mention Lousiville is a democratic city.

I'm not from Lousville and don't want to be. But what I don't understand is why the HSUS ordinance can't accomodate sporting dogs. Last time I checked the majority of attack cases weren't done by hunting dogs. I doubt Tito takes his pitbull bird hunting. If HSUS real motive was to protect citizens from attacks they could follow Miami's or Orange County's footsteps and ban pitbulls and attack dogs. It just seems like there is more to the issue than just the issue. But what do I know.

[BUCKHEAVEN]

Id get in bed with the high fence operators to fight the HSUS, but Ill never get in bed with the HSUS to fight against anything.

Makes 2 of us.

Makes 3 of us.:)