here is something to think about when it comes to taxes

[treerat]

yep,,this is something that has been eating at me,,i have really thought hard about this,,,,but no matter what you do,,,even visit the nature room(taxes on water,,sewer and/or electric if you have septic and well),,,you have to pay taxes,,,even have to pay taxes on taxes,,,really seems like the U.S. taxes us to death,,,speaking of death,,,you have to pay taxes after you die too,,,,,i have been contiplating on this for weeks,,,and i have not come up with one thing that you can do and not have to pay taxes for 1 thing or another,,,,

[westkybanded]

Thank a democrat for all those taxes.....

Won't cost you a dime! ;)

[Rem7600]

I read an article a while back saying that we have to work from Jan 1 to May 7, just to pay our taxes. I get a little steamed every time I look at a utility bill. They are loaded with extra taxes and that does not include the hidden taxes that we pay on many products. A surtax, the best of all, is a tax on the tax. Someone had to be pretty sharp (greedy) to think of that one.:rolleyes:

[C.L.Button]

Reminds me of a line I heard once,,,,

I'm mad as he(( and ain't gonna take it anymore ! :eek: :D

OK so do we revolt or what ? :confused:

[westkybanded]

Reminds me of a line I heard once,,,,

I'm mad as he(( and ain't gonna take it anymore ! :eek: :D

OK so do we revolt or what ? :confused:

"God forbid we should ever be twenty years without such a rebellion.
The people cannot be all, and always, well informed. The part which is
wrong will be discontented, in proportion to the importance of the facts
they misconceive. If they remain quiet under such misconceptions,
it is lethargy, the forerunner of death to the public liberty. ...
And what country can preserve its liberties, if it's rulers are not
warned from time to time, that this people preserve the spirit of
resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as
to the facts, pardon and pacify them. What signify a few lives lost
in a century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from
time to time, with the blood of patriots and tyrants.
It is its natural manure."

Thomas Jefferson....

[C.L.Button]

Westkybanded I'm right behind you buddy. I hate them wage stealin thieves. :mad: I've had more than one go-round with a certain governmental robbery group. :mad: The part that makes me the maddest is they do it with paper and ink pen. Oh the stories I could tell you. :rolleyes: :mad:

[ecmbowhunter]

good post!!

[hwright]

Open your own small business. I cashed in some 401 K last year to help pay for our adoption. I knew the taxes would kill me so I opened a small business and took a big lose. Instead of paying the goverment about 6500 dollars on the 401K, I ended up getting about a thousand back. Now I did have to spend some money to do it but I have things to show for it instead of a cancled check to the IRS.

As for the taxes, theres not much I can say other then vote Republican. And that includes your local elections. HEATH

[Auk1124]

Taxes suck for sure but if voting Repub is the answer I don't understand why there wasn't some real relief before the last election. Oh wait, I forgot the capital gains tax cut for the millionaires. That helped a bunch. :rolleyes: If anyone thinks voting one party or another into office will do anything about middle class America's tax burden I wonder why it hasn't worked before. Face it, strip away the parties and they are all the same.

[AteUp]

I don't like paying taxes any more than the next guy, but what would the US be without taxes? Anybody want to move somewhere where the taxes are low and the military sucks, the emergency services are relatively ineffective and the building codes are non-existant?? I for one don't. We pay taxes to make America the greatest country on the planet.

[eddiejohn4]

Lets have a straight flat rate tax. pay on what you buy, not taxed on the same puchase time after time.

[Wildcat]

Taxes suck for sure but if voting Repub is the answer I don't understand why there wasn't some real relief before the last election. Oh wait, I forgot the capital gains tax cut for the millionaires. That helped a bunch. :rolleyes: If anyone thinks voting one party or another into office will do anything about middle class America's tax burden I wonder why it hasn't worked before. Face it, strip away the parties and they are all the same.


Sorry but you are wrong. Both President Reagan's and Bush's tax cuts were for everybody and the ones that got the MOST relief was the middle to lower class, not the rich. The current tax rates of 15, 28, 31, 36, and 39.6 percent was made into a simplified rate structure of 10, 15, 25, and 33 percent, the middle class got the biggest cut from 28 to 15 and 31 to 15 percent.

The only people that did NOT get any tax relief was the ones that did NOT pay any taxes like welfare, disability, etc and people who did not report their income.

As for capitial gains for the rich, do you ever understand what capitial gains are??

There are over 300 million people in the United States and more than 220 million people own some forum of imvestment like stocks, bonds, mutual funds, money market, 401Kplan and other securties. ANYTIME some stocks are sold for a profit wither by the stockholder himself or a mutual fumd manager or a 401K plan that becomes capitial gains. It does not mater if it's one single share of stock or millions of shares, it's all the same. These 220 million people are investing for retirment, they get the SAME capital gains tax as the "rich" and they get the same tax cuts. By the way, matual funds buy and sell millions of shares a day, every one of them are taxed.

Here again the people in the LOWEST tax brackets got the BIGGEST tax cuts.

In the United States, individuals and corporations pay income tax on the net total of all their capital gains just as they do on other sorts of income, but the tax rate for individuals is lower on "long-term capital gains", which are gains on assets that had been held for over one year before being sold. The tax rate on long-term gains was reduced in 2003 to 15%, or to 5% for individuals in the lowest two income tax brackets. Short-term capital gains are taxed at a higher rate: the ordinary income tax rate. In 2011 these reduced tax rates will "sunset", or revert back to the rates in effect before 2003, which were generally 20%.

The reduced 15% tax rate on eligible dividends and capital gains, previously scheduled to expire in 2008, has been extended through 2010 as a result of the Tax Reconciliation Act signed into law by President Bush on May 17, 2006. As a result:

In 2008, 2009, and 2010, the tax rate on eligible dividends and capital gains is 0% for those in the 10% and 15% income tax brackets.

After 2010, dividends will be taxed at the taxpayer's ordinary income tax rate, regardless of his or her tax bracket.

After 2010, the long-term capital gains tax rate will be 20% (10% for taxpayers in the 15% tax bracket).

After 2010, the qualified five-year 18% capital gains rate (8% for taxpayers in the 15% tax bracket) will be reinstated.

Technically, a "cost basis" is used, rather than the simple purchase price, to determine the taxable amount of the gain. The cost basis is the original purchase price, adjusted for various things including additional improvements or investments, taxes paid on dividends, certain fees, and depreciation.


But don't worry, soon all these cuts will be gone and we all will be paying higher taxes, Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid has publicy promised they will raise all our taxes while they being millionares will do what they have always done, hide their money in tax sheders.

[trust me]

I got a break from the capital gains tax cut on some small investments and I'm as far removed from a millionaire as you can get. Bush also gave me a break on the kiddies by upping the deductions per child, times 3 for me.

The only thing the Republicans did wrong was they didn't cut their social program spending a commensurate amount. Repubs waste as much money as the democrats because they have to pacify the special interest groups in an effort to stay in control.

About the only taxes I don't mind paying is the local municipal tax and the school taxes. At least in those two areas I can see constant reminders that I'm getting some return on my money.

[MsgMills]

I don't like paying taxes any more than the next guy, but what would the US be without taxes? Anybody want to move somewhere where the taxes are low and the military sucks, the emergency services are relatively ineffective and the building codes are non-existant?? I for one don't. We pay taxes to make America the greatest country on the planet.

Dang Ateup, I got to agree with your post 100%....I too don't like it, but it has to be done...Now look at what the Democrats have already said since taking over the Congress again....Sorry citizens, but we have got to raise taxes again in order to promote our way of life and beliefs....Didn';t see the Republicans raising taxes while they were in charge...At least the Republicans gave money back to the citizens during their control the previous 6 years.... Ever seen a Democrat controlled Congress give money back to you....Didn't think so......:(

[C.L.Button]

Why don't they just go in there and print up some more money ? Gezz then we could just abolish taxes ? After all they do control the ink and paper right ? :rolleyes: :D

[westkybanded]

Why don't they just go in there and print up some more money ? Gezz then we could just abolish taxes ? After all they do control the ink and paper right ? :rolleyes: :D

The scary thing is that there are people out there that think that way! They don't understand that currency is a commodity just like oil or milk. Supply and availability increases and the value decreases.

[C.L.Button]

Yah I know but I had to say it. Kind of like wishing I was roasting the Easter Bunny for dinner today. :D

[Wildcat]

The scary thing is that there are people out there that think that way! They don't understand that currency is a commodity just like oil or milk. Supply and availability increases and the value decreases.


Shhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!

Don't talk simple sense, it confuses some people. Make your answers long so they get lost in them.;)

[Multidigits]

Our tax rate is still smaller than what those in some countries pay. For example, you might pay 40% or a little more but in China you pay 100%. Everything you make goes to the govn. and they give you back what you need to make more to give to them. Same with any other communist country. Plus, you do it all working at what they tell you to do.

Seems to me that most of teh people that bitch about paying taxes, actually pay the least amount, and some pay none at all, yet they still bitch about it???

[Wildcat]

Mulits is right,

In some socialist countries like France they pay much higher taxes on EVERYTHING. Their income tax is something like 40-45%. They pay the same world price on oil as we do but look at the prices they charge for gas there, $6-7 a gal. The reason for such high gas prices is they tax the gas 100%, doubling the price. Sales tax there is something like 14%. Hotel tax, rent tax, homeowner tax, farm tax, etc, etc, they all are twice or more as high as here in the US.

The reason for such high taxes is that's how they pay for their socialist programs, nothing is free someone has to pay for it.

[Auk1124]

As for capitial gains for the rich, do you ever understand what capitial gains are??

There are over 300 million people in the United States and more than 220 million people own some forum of imvestment like stocks, bonds, mutual funds, money market, 401Kplan and other securties. ANYTIME some stocks are sold for a profit wither by the stockholder himself or a mutual fumd manager or a 401K plan that becomes capitial gains. It does not mater if it's one single share of stock or millions of shares, it's all the same. These 220 million people are investing for retirment, they get the SAME capital gains tax as the "rich" and they get the same tax cuts. By the way, matual funds buy and sell millions of shares a day, every one of them are taxed.

Here again the people in the LOWEST tax brackets got the BIGGEST tax cuts.

I disagree. You challenge my knowledge of what capital gains means - do you know what a 401(k) is? IRAs are non-taxable until withdrawn. So all that stock being bought, sold, traded in those 401(k)s and other IRAs - which are most likely to be the stocks middle America is "investing for retirement" as you say, benefit not one whit from a capital gains tax cut.

There are households in this country with stock in taxable accounts, but who are they? Less than 1/5 of the households in America with the bottom 60% of this country's income have stock in a taxable accounts. On the flip side, nearly 3/4 of the households with the top 10% of income have taxable stock. Now, who is really benefitting? Does that sound like "the LOWEST tax brackets are getting the BIGGEST tax cuts, as you say?

Of the total dividend and capital gains income in this country, over half of that number goes to the very top, the households with annual incomes over a million. Another 25% or so goes to the next layer, the households with incomes over 200,000. Another 10% or so goes to household with incomes over 100,000. and finally 4% goes to the households in this country with incomes less than $50,000 (which by the way comprises well over half the households in this country).

Again, who benefits from a clip in capital gains? Middle and lower bracket America benefit some, but to claim that the lowest tax brackets benefit the most from a clip in capital gains is absurd, considering only 4% of those households have any taxable capital gains to begin with. And if you are wondering, those figures come from the IRS, not some liberal wacko.

[Wildcat]

You need to go back to the IRS and double check your numbers since the numbers I posted were taken straight from the IRS web site and they are UPDATED. Cut and paste. So your not disagreeing with me but the IRS and THEIR numbers.

Plus not all 401K plans are IRAs, I never once posted anything here about IRAs since I knew they were deffered taxes but I will have to pay the capitial gains later when I cash them in.

The LOWEST tax brackets got the BIGGEST tax cuts.

Again not to worry, the democrats have promised to raise the taxes for EVERYBODY.

[Wildcat]

Here's something else I found.

Thursday, April 05, 2007
In Case You Missed It: The Coming Tax Increase






From The Wall Street Journal


Editorial
April 5, 2007







PDF Format


[C]ongress has just lit a fuse for the biggest tax increase in history.


The new House and Senate majorities have now passed budget resolutions -- five-year budget outlines -- that include the repeal of the Bush tax cuts of 2001 and 2003. ... [U]nder the cover of zero media attention, Democrats are constructing a budget process that will make a tax increase all but inevitable.


The ploy here is "pay-as-you-go" budget rules that Democrats are implementing in the name of "restoring fiscal responsibility." ... But everyone in Washington knows that "paygo" is all about making tax cuts more difficult, and not about slowing the growth of spending.


Under "paygo," extending the Bush tax cuts is itself a tax cut that must be offset either with cuts in entitlement spending or with other tax increases. ...


This is a big enough political con. But an even bigger ruse is the Democratic-media chorus that the Bush tax cuts must be repealed because they've left the Treasury high and dry. ...


But the lower rates also provided a spur to incentives that led to a rebound in investment, stock prices and ultimately in economic growth, individual incomes and corporate profits. This produced, in turn, a very sharp rebound in federal tax receipts ...


Despite the Bush tax cuts -- or we should say because of them -- federal revenues are above where they've been for most of the last half century. The government is far from starved for cash.


What Democrats really don't want you to know is what will happen to receipts after 2010 if the tax cuts expire: CBO says the feds will grab a huge additional chunk of the economy to spend ... [T]axes as a share of the economy would exceed every postwar year except for the 20.9% of 2000, when the stock bubble and bonuses tossed many taxpayers into higher tax brackets. ...


A tax increase of that magnitude could well lead to a recession and a plunge in receipts. ...


Do nothing and taxes will rise as much as they have at any one time since World War II. Democrats have made the decision to obscure this burning fuse, and the press corps is ignoring it. But that doesn't mean the rest of the country has to play along

[RocketRider]

Again, look at the Fair Tax! I'ts simple for the morons and fair for the rest of us.

RR~

[treerat]

i didn't think this was going to turn in to a political cat fight,,:D :D :eek: :D ,,,but all of it is fun to read:D :D

[corndogggy]

Reminds me of a line I heard once,,,,

Yeah me too:

"Certainty? In this world nothing is certain but death and taxes."
-- Benjamin Franklin


You guys act like this is a new thing or something, but Ben Franklin was born over 300 years ago and he had it figured out. :D

[Bray]

Paying taxes is just a part of life. You don't go to a store and expect them to just give you stuff. Same with the government. They provide us a service and must be compensated for it.

What gets me is that I work part time and go to school. I don't make that much money but it's enough for me to get by. I am happy to be working and am thankful for what I have. But when I file taxes I don't get everything back and that's fine with me. But take people on welfare. They almost always choose not to work. They make more money than I do (fact) and don't have to pay taxes on it. Becuase I work and choose to invest in my future (and my countries) I pay taxes. But take someone on welfare, they are rewarded for their lazyness (I know some people NEED welfare but most don't) and in no way contribute to society. That is where you can thank a democrat. Instead of my social security money going to benifit my retirement it goes to a chain smoking 30 year old who chooses not to get a job. Why not privitize social security?

[slickhead slayer]

Taxes suck for sure but if voting Repub is the answer I don't understand why there wasn't some real relief before the last election. Oh wait, I forgot the capital gains tax cut for the millionaires. That helped a bunch. :rolleyes: If anyone thinks voting one party or another into office will do anything about middle class America's tax burden I wonder why it hasn't worked before. Face it, strip away the parties and they are all the same.

Wow, I am shocked that anyone could really make these statements. Your biased beyond belief if you think that both parties are the same in regards to tax relief. As a matter of fact, I am not sure how they could be any different in their actions.
The Republican Congress gave us tax cuts, most Dems were against them. Now that the Dems control congress, they are already talking of repealing them.
So one side gave us tax cuts, and one side wants to repeal them. And yet you claim they are one in the same???:confused:

I won't repeat the numbers since Wildcat already posted them, but the middle class did in fact get a tax cut, and it was them that got the largest percentage. The lowest income earners were even taken off the tax rolls completely by raising the poverty level.
There was other tax relief also, including a rebate, which was not determined by income. And child credits, which once again was not decided on income. You make $20,000 a year or $1mill a year, you still got the same child credit.
And lots of us middle class folks appreciated all of this tax relief.
We just logged a small portion of our farm, and we have to pay capital gains on the money. So its not just stock owners that benefitted from the lowering of capital gains. Its anybody that has assets, and we all have assets.

[C.L.Button]

Yeah me too:

"Certainty? In this world nothing is certain but death and taxes."
-- Benjamin Franklin


You guys act like this is a new thing or something, but Ben Franklin was born over 300 years ago and he had it figured out. :D

Amen Corndogggy but these days they have gotten considerbly greedy ! :D

[KYCatBirdHunter]

seems a little bit shortsighted to applaud tax-cuts while the nation is facing a massive and growing defecit.

Yes, dems do typically indicate higher taxes, but guess what.... they use the money to DO SOMETHING. Defecit gets smaller. Interest stops killing us. Maybe, oh maybe, we can get out from under China's thumb and be just a little bit fiscally responsible.

[Multidigits]

seems a little bit shortsighted to applaud tax-cuts while the nation is facing a massive and growing defecit.

Yes, dems do typically indicate higher taxes, but guess what.... they use the money to DO SOMETHING. Defecit gets smaller. Interest stops killing us. Maybe, oh maybe, we can get out from under China's thumb and be just a little bit fiscally responsible.


Do Something is correct....they give it away to people that don't pay taxes.

[trust me]

Dems' record of deficit management is no better than the Repubs. Clinton's claims of balancing the budget were because of huge unexpected increases in tax revenue, not because he cut spending.

One party or the other is going to have to stand up and say "enough" and put a serious dent in all the entitlement spendings. Neither show any inclination to do so. Congress spends the money, and Congress sets the tax rates. They should be required to operate in the black just like I have to.

[slickhead slayer]

seems a little bit shortsighted to applaud tax-cuts while the nation is facing a massive and growing defecit.

Yes, dems do typically indicate higher taxes, but guess what.... they use the money to DO SOMETHING. Defecit gets smaller. Interest stops killing us. Maybe, oh maybe, we can get out from under China's thumb and be just a little bit fiscally responsible.

Tax cuts and deficits are two different topics. And after Bushs tax cuts, the governement actually took more money in, not less. It supports the theory that tax cuts improve the economy, which means more people working, which means more people paying taxes. More people buying, which means more taxes. More people investing, which means more taxes.

The Democrats and Republicans have increased the deficit over the last 30 years. The only party to balance the budget in the last 30 years were the Republicans during Clintons second term. Congress, not Presidents, pass the budget.

[Auk1124]

You need to go back to the IRS and double check your numbers since the numbers I posted were taken straight from the IRS web site and they are UPDATED. Cut and paste. So your not disagreeing with me but the IRS and THEIR numbers.

Plus not all 401K plans are IRAs, I never once posted anything here about IRAs since I knew they were deffered taxes but I will have to pay the capitial gains later when I cash them in.

The LOWEST tax brackets got the BIGGEST tax cuts.

Again not to worry, the democrats have promised to raise the taxes for EVERYBODY.

http://www.irs.gov/taxstats/indtaxstats/article/0,,id=133414,00.html

is where I'm getting my numbers from, take a look at the stats and you'll see what I'm talking about when comparing reported capital gains and the tax brackets. I don't have a clue how to cut and paste excel spreadsheets, or if they'd let me. To be fair the latest figures are for 04, but that's what the irs posts. Look at the number of returns per tax bracket and compare to the reported capital gains per tax bracket. Lower tax brackets report less capital gains, so a clip in capital gains can't benefit them more, and I don't understand how you say they could benefit greater from a tax cut they don't report on their income taxes to begin with.

[maxcam]

yep,,this is something that has been eating at me,,i have really thought hard about this,,,,but no matter what you do,,,even visit the nature room(taxes on water,,sewer and/or electric if you have septic and well),,,you have to pay taxes,,,even have to pay taxes on taxes,,,really seems like the U.S. taxes us to death,,,speaking of death,,,you have to pay taxes after you die too,,,,,i have been contiplating on this for weeks,,,and i have not come up with one thing that you can do and not have to pay taxes for 1 thing or another,,,,

You need a legitimate home based business so you can have lots of legal deductions........With my home based business I can even write off my hunting and fishing trips plus make a commission on my travel......

[Multidigits]

and he said you need a legit business!!!

[Al]

The Dems are the party of tax and spend!!

[Al]

You need a legitimate home based business so you can have lots of legal deductions........With my home based business I can even write off my hunting and fishing trips plus make a commission on my travel......
Keep talking Max, the IRS auditors are going to be knocking on your door if they read your post.
You can make all the deductions you want, till they catch on.

[hwright]

Paying taxes is just a part of life. You don't go to a store and expect them to just give you stuff. Same with the government. They provide us a service and must be compensated for it.




:eek: What service would that be????? HEATH

[hwright]

seems a little bit shortsighted to applaud tax-cuts while the nation is facing a massive and growing defecit.

Yes, dems do typically indicate higher taxes, but guess what.... they use the money to DO SOMETHING. Defecit gets smaller. Interest stops killing us. Maybe, oh maybe, we can get out from under China's thumb and be just a little bit fiscally responsible.

Where am I supposed to start with this one?

1, the defecit is not growing it is shrinking.
2, Dems do ALWAYS indicate higher taxes, and they do do something with the extra money. They buy votes through entiltelment programs like welfare and medicare. And coming soon is free health care through socialized health care.
3, You want out from under China's thumb? Get rid of the unions. Why do you think we buy products made in China? Its because they are cheap. At the end of the day I don't give a rats azz about some moron making 30 dollars per hour for a 10 dollar per hour job. I only care about whats in my checking account. Drop the unions and lower the price and I will buy american every time. But I won't over pay 1 penny just because something is made here instead of over there. HEATH

[maxcam]

Keep talking Max, the IRS auditors are going to be knocking on your door if they read your post.
You can make all the deductions you want, till they catch on.

Let them come and investigate.......Im a liscensed travel agent with an online travel booking engine just like Travelocity......Check it out....

www.ybitravel.com (http://www.ybitravel.com)

If your interested in doing this yourself just shoot me a pm and Ill show you how to do it..........