Is QDM ruining hunting?

[Tom Borck]

All too often folks get QDM and TDM wrong! Many hunters believe that antler restrictions is QDM, it is not, thats TDM!

TDM is not only running up costs of hunting, but also turning young hunters away from hunting.

I know, it is all about the hunt, but try telling that to a young child who sees a nice deer they would like to take and you tell them NO, wait until he gets bigger.

Another problem I see facing TDM (QDM) is driving hunting costs through the roof!! We leased several tracts of land and in one year we went from $2 an ac to $5 an ac!!

To some degree I blame the QDM philosophy! What is a trophy to me may not be to you.

Just my .02

[huntr467]

Antler resrtiction is QDM in most hunters eyes because in a QDM program you want to limit the harvest of young bucks. The antler restriction is the easiest way for most to even come close to aging a deer and if done right the restriction should be set by harvest data, to protect almost all of the 1.5 and a good protion of the 2.5 year olds.
In the early 90's I ran a club of 2700 acres in Ga. we hired biologists, enlisted state biologists help, kept detailed harvest data and made what I thought was a respectable attempt at QDM. Our herd started showing some great results after about 5 yrs. in wieghts and antler development. Then the farmer planted pine trees and that all went down the drain.
I did see first hand the good and bad of QDM in those times.
And I would have to agree that it has had more of a negative effect on the general hunting population than a postive one.
Most clubs and landowners calling themself practicing QDM on 800 acres and imposing an 8pt. rule or 4 on one side are kidding themselves. The princaples behind QDM are sound and I believe in them on a larger scale.
But it not intended to produce trophy animals and I don't think they have ever said that. People have just jumped on the band wagon and thinks its the greatest thing since sliced bread. It's not for everybody and it's a ton of work.

[Tom Borck]

Antler resrtiction is QDM in most hunters eyes because in a QDM program you want to limit the harvest of young bucks. The antler restriction is the easiest way for most to even come close to aging a deer and if done right the restriction should be set by harvest data, to protect almost all of the 1.5 and a good protion of the 2.5 year olds.
In the early 90's I ran a club of 2700 acres in Ga. we hired biologists, enlisted state biologists help, kept detailed harvest data and made what I thought was a respectable attempt at QDM. Our herd started showing some great results after about 5 yrs. in wieghts and antler development. Then the farmer planted pine trees and that all went down the drain.
I did see first hand the good and bad of QDM in those times.
And I would have to agree that it has had more of a negative effect on the general hunting population than a postive one.
Most clubs and landowners calling themself practicing QDM on 800 acres and imposing an 8pt. rule or 4 on one side are kidding themselves. The princaples behind QDM are sound and I believe in them on a larger scale.
But it not intended to produce trophy animals and I don't think they have ever said that. People have just jumped on the band wagon and thinks its the greatest thing since sliced bread. It's not for everybody and it's a ton of work.

Thanks!

In our area we have 2 very distinct genetics, very large 6 points and deer which are missing one or both brow tines. We have killed 6 deer on our place that are missing one or both brow tines.

Large six points! Heres a trial cam of one and yet another one I killed a few years back. The trail cam photo was taken a year ago.

Under 4 point on one side rule, this genetic trait would NEVER die out!!!

[huntr467]

Yeah we tend to have a 7pt gene in our herd. Just like your deer large mature 4.5+ yr. olds. Heavy mass long tined. But if It was in a club situation and we decided that we were gonna try and get rid of the gene, most hunters would be shooting the young 1.5 - 2.5 yr. olds so it would be counter productive. I think the best thing is the one buck rule as far as helping generate "trophy" bucks, and it allows first time hunters to take the first buck they see. But the media has taken that fun out of the hunt and implied pressure on youngsters to go for the bigguns. Or they were sitting at camp and watched as older hunters get ribbed for shooting a small one...It's gotten out of hand, it's sad and QDM has played it's part in the belittling of the little ones.

[Multidigits]

All too often folks get QDM and TDM wrong! Many hunters believe that antler restrictions is QDM, it is not, thats TDM!

TDM is not only running up costs of hunting, but also turning young hunters away from hunting.

I know, it is all about the hunt, but try telling that to a young child who sees a nice deer they would like to take and you tell them NO, wait until he gets bigger.

Another problem I see facing TDM (QDM) is driving hunting costs through the roof!! We leased several tracts of land and in one year we went from $2 an ac to $5 an ac!!

To some degree I blame the QDM philosophy! What is a trophy to me may not be to you.

Just my .02


Comments: Neither QDM nor TDM control the cost of hunting. The cost is control by the lack of suitable places to hunt. Land prices and lease prices are control by supply and demand. More and more hunters are from an urban environment and don't have family with farms and huge places to hunt, so they either have to buy land or lease a spot to hunt. A better quality of deer might make it a quicker sale or make it fetch a higher lease price, but it's not the only factor. For example, duck and geese leases are as high or higher than a good deer spot.

In your example, anyone that had a lease for $2 an acre should have known that they had a bargin price and that sooner or later that price would change.

[huntr467]

In your example, anyone that had a lease for $2 an acre should have known that they had a bargin price and that sooner or later that price would change

even the $5 an acre he spoke of is a bargain from what I have seen.

[nwest]

True QDM is a lot of work but I believe it is worth it. How many on here are actually members of QDMA? I have been for 3 years and while it has not put any "trophy" on my wall it has a few of the nieghbors:D . I had a few encounters with nice 3 year olds this year, but did not take one. If you are not a member the magazine alone is worth the price. I have learned more about the biology side of hunting in thier mag than anywhere else.


As far as the effects on hunting I think most of it comes from "weekend Trophy hunters" than anywhere. Not to say that I won't give anyone over 18 that kills a immature buck a little kick in the ribs. :D

[slickhead slayer]

All too often folks get QDM and TDM wrong! Many hunters believe that antler restrictions is QDM, it is not, thats TDM!

TDM is not only running up costs of hunting, but also turning young hunters away from hunting.

I know, it is all about the hunt, but try telling that to a young child who sees a nice deer they would like to take and you tell them NO, wait until he gets bigger.

Another problem I see facing TDM (QDM) is driving hunting costs through the roof!! We leased several tracts of land and in one year we went from $2 an ac to $5 an ac!!

To some degree I blame the QDM philosophy! What is a trophy to me may not be to you.

Just my .02

I know a zillion people who practice QDM, and I don't know any who don't let kids and first time hunters take what they want. Folks who practice QDM are usually the most dedicated of people to the sport and the herd.

QDM is the act of increasing the quality of your lands deer herd. How can anybody find fault with increasing the quality of your deer herd?

We have a one buck limit, nobody practicing QDM is stopping you from taking what you want to shoot.
You get one buck, shoot what you want and don't worry about what others do.

[buckfever]

I know a zillion people who practice QDM, and I don't know any who don't let kids and first time hunters take what they want. Folks who practice QDM are usually the most dedicated of people to the sport and the herd.

QDM is the act of increasing the quality of your lands deer herd. How can anybody find fault with increasing the quality of your deer herd?

We have a one buck limit, nobody practicing QDM is stopping you from taking what you want to shoot.
You get one buck, shoot what you want and don't worry about what others do.

I would second Slick's comments. We practice QDM to a large degree, but I also let a bunch of kids I didn't even know come out and hunt the property during the youth season, and there were no restrictions on what any of 'em shot. Some of the kids voluntarily passed on some younger bucks and ended up just killing some does. One shot a nice 7 ptr (2 yrs old) and another shot a beautiful 8 ptr.

That being said, I don't let adults (at least experienced adults) shoot whatever they want. If anything our mgmt approach and the possibility of shooting a nice deer even fanned their desire to try it again.

All in all, anybody who wants to shoot a deer can. I don't think that QDM has had any impact on people's desire to hunt or their ability. JMO.

[naturalelite]

I know a zillion people who practice QDM, and I don't know any who don't let kids and first time hunters take what they want. Folks who practice QDM are usually the most dedicated of people to the sport and the herd.

QDM is the act of increasing the quality of your lands deer herd. How can anybody find fault with increasing the quality of your deer herd?

We have a one buck limit, nobody practicing QDM is stopping you from taking what you want to shoot.
You get one buck, shoot what you want and don't worry about what others do.

Exactly.

I hunt several different places and practice QDM on two of the farms. The other place the land owner wants every deer seen killed so I try and help him out. He raises a garden and they destroy it. Gots to keep the landowner happy. Staying within the legal limit of course

[Xi Bowhunter]

Thanks!

In our area we have 2 very distinct genetics, very large 6 points and deer which are missing one or both brow tines. We have killed 6 deer on our place that are missing one or both brow tines.

Large six points! Heres a trial cam of one and yet another one I killed a few years back. The trail cam photo was taken a year ago.

Under 4 point on one side rule, this genetic trait would NEVER die out!!!
I see nothing wrong with the buck in the pic. I would shoot him anyday.

[Tom Borck]

In your example, anyone that had a lease for $2 an acre should have known that they had a bargin price and that sooner or later that price would change.

In some regions this might be a bargain price, but around here hunters dont have the money hunters who live in large urban areas have. I currently have access to several place and don't pay a dime.

We used to pay $27 for right at 2000 ac, this year it will be $500! We have LOST many hunters because of this and now we have to find "Urban Hunters" with $$$$$$$$

Supply and demand! If a state sees an increase in monster bucks taken the lease price will go up!!

Let hunters make their own choices.

[Tom Borck]

I see nothing wrong with the buck in the pic. I would shoot him anyday.

Oh I agree, but in some counties you could not kill him!:rolleyes:

[nwest]

I see nothing wrong with the buck in the pic. I would shoot him anyday.

There is nothing "wrong" with this deer, but if you are practicing QDM he would be less than desirable. True QDM has nothing to do with the rack it has much more to do with the maturity of the animal. I would speculate this deer is around 3? it takes 5-6 years for a whitetail to reach maturity.

Tom what counties are you speaking of? I am not aware of any anlter restrictions in KY.

At the end of the day its your money you spent on the tag, take whatever makes you happy. Just don't get red when I poke you in the ribs a little:D

[KYhunter79]

Multi has it right. The prices of leases has nothing to do with QDM. It has to do with less and less places to hunt and more and more hunters. Farmers are reluctant to give you permission to hunt when they lease the rights to urban hunters for rediculous prices. It also effects small game hunters, because the farmer no longer has the right to give them the right to hunt because the land is leased to someone for everything.

[Rob]

Last summer, I bought a farm where strict QDM had been practiced for the last 15 years. On opening morning, I walked my nephew, who had been deer hunting with me but who had never killed a deer, to the "honeyhole" stand. We got there at 5:50AM. From 6AM until 6:35AM, he saw 22 does/fawns/buttons & 15 racked bucks. At 6:35, he shot the largest of the bucks, a nice 2 1/2 yr old that we are having mounted. That morning, he also saw a HUGE doe with a scar on her back leg. He named her Doezilla. He hunted for her every day the rest of gun & late MZ season, saw her 3 more times, but never had a shot. He is determined to get her this year. Now, he is a certified deer hunting fanatic. We took only does & one other buck (a 3 1/2 year old 8 pt a kid killed in early youth season) all year long. We had fun. We had fresh tenderloin, backstraps, & steaks. So, explain to me again just how QDM is ruining our deer hunting?

[Xi Bowhunter]

Just don't get red when I poke you in the ribs a little:D
Poke me in the ribs all you want, I'm just glad to be able to be out there:D

[skin_dog1]

I'm 100% against antler restrictions. They accomplish nothing that a 1 buck limit doesn't. I'm also against anyone restricting a first time hunter from shooting the deer of their choice. That is just silly and does the sport an injustice. I am for other restrictions that aren't too popular.

[Multidigits]

QDM is not about any restrictions on antlers. It's about producing antlers in other ways, such as providing a balanced herd and by providing plenty of food and by providing for a older age class of deer. Most people don't know it, but ALL of Ky. is under QDM and experienced deer managers admire KY's success. We have been under QDM for about 14 or 15 years. Most of what people are talking about when QDM is mentioned is TDM. Trophy deer are a side effect of a good QDM program, like the one that KY. has in place.

[huntr467]

QDM is not about any restrictions on antlers. It's about producing antlers in other ways, such as providing a balanced herd and by providing plenty of food and by providing for a older age class of deer. Most people don't know it, but ALL of Ky. is under QDM and experienced deer managers admire KY's success. We have been under QDM for about 14 or 15 years. Most of what people are talking about when QDM is mentioned is TDM. Trophy deer are a side effect of a good QDM program, like the one that KY. has in place.
I agree with this statement. But, I think the one buck limit is the real reason Ky. has such great success. Make it a 2 buck rule with some sort of antler restrictions on one of the bucks and the outcome would be different. One buck rules can be used for management just as antler restrictions are. Antler restrictions and "QDM" in most hunters minds spell big bucks, which in turn does create a rise in leases and land prices in states or areas which are known for big bucks. If I had a 1000 ac. farm that I advertised was managed under "QDM" and I have proven it's success with pictures of trophy bucks, and another 1000 ac. 10 mi. down the road is also available with no trophy class animals taken which will cost more to lease or buy?? Then yes it would bring more money than the average lease. You can't dispute that. I agree supply and demand comes first then you start paying based on quality.
I feel there is a big misconeption by a lot of hunters about QDM.

[Luckybuck]

Yes, I honestly think QDM turns a lot of folks off to hunting and makes land harder to come by with increasing lease prices.

[MOKYHunter]

I'm all for the 1 buck limit. I waited all season for a "shooter" buck and never killed a buck, because I didn't want to waste my buck tag on a 1 1/2 year old buck. The thing that I think hurts us as well as MO (where my land is), is the Telecheck system. It is not the honest hunters that we have to worry about. It is the hunters out there that lease land or own land that choose not to check in a buck (because they don't feel that the buck is big enough) so they could wait for a larger buck. The chances of them getting caught by not checking in the smaller one are gonna be slim to none. I really feel that not forcing hunters to physically check their deer are keeping the honest hunters honest and the outlaws being outlaws.:) :)

[Tom Borck]

Yes, I honestly think QDM turns a lot of folks off to hunting and makes land harder to come by with increasing lease prices.

In the past several years we have had many members quit a QDM Club and come over to ours! Mainly because the cost, lack of really big deer and the pressure. I don't know, I don't hunt in a QDM county and our club is a self imposed QDM. But, I have seen more hunters complain about it than brag about it.

[broadhead]

If somebody wants to follow QDM in their club, all the power to them. That is their choice. However, I do not agree with state mandated QDM rules.

[huntr467]

I'm all for the 1 buck limit. I waited all season for a "shooter" buck and never killed a buck, because I didn't want to waste my buck tag on a 1 1/2 year old buck. The thing that I think hurts us as well as MO (where my land is), is the Telecheck system. It is not the honest hunters that we have to worry about. It is the hunters out there that lease land or own land that choose not to check in a buck (because they don't feel that the buck is big enough) so they could wait for a larger buck. The chances of them getting caught by not checking in the smaller one are gonna be slim to none. I really feel that not forcing hunters to physically check their deer are keeping the honest hunters honest and the outlaws being outlaws.:) :)
It still boils down to honesty. Telecheck or physically checking doesn't matter...if I guy wants to not check a deer he ain't checking it. They will clean it in the woods or at their barn and no one will be the more wiser. Transporting deer or parts is the same thing you have to have a confirmation # from telecheck or a tag from physical check stations.

[bigpuddin43]

QDM has nothing to do with antlers it has to do with numbers!! QDM is used to reach but not exceed the carrying capacity of the land!! Trophy deer management is holding the population at less than carrying capacity to ensure that deer intake as many nutrients as they can to increase body and antler size!! also QDM is restricting harvest to mature deer to make for a more natural age structure!! This to me makes hunting even better to watch a 3 1/2 yr old run 1 1/2 yr olds out of a field at the begining of rut!! a better age structure will show an increase in rut activity!! QDM is also used to keep the buck doe ratio where we want it to increase competition between bucks and those with better genetics will out compete and therefore out breed the lesser bucks(If correct age structure in herd) so your herd will manage itself for genetics. So ignore the anters and look at the age of the deer you are shooting!! If QDM is practiced antler sizes will get larger because bucks will be allowed to get some age, and genetics will naturally improve till they reach their full potential!!

Now as far as first year hunters i am all for letting them shoot whatever they want because they are the future of our sport!! But after that first buck they need to begin to learn how to preserve the sport cause if they dont why are we worried about getting them involved in the first place!!!

just my .02

[Luckybuck]

Out of all the QDM'ers I have talked to, zero have killed their limits on does(regardless of their home state), but preach to everybody else about what they should kill, what they should let walk, blah blah blah. Hunting should be about having a little fun, relaxation, and spending time with family or friends. If hunting is so much of a job that folks get bashed for taking a deer they want or have plans to eat, then shame on the sorry SOB's that tell them it isn't right. A deer is a deer is a deer. Too many folks get wayyyy too hooked on large antlers....don't get me started on the qdm argument that it is a "by-product"....Most folks claim to be using QDM but it turns out it is only TDM, and yes it is prevalent in many states and will eventually divide and conquer most big game hunters.

[Xi Bowhunter]

IMO, too much importance is put on QDM, and it is taking away from the real sport of hunting. Getting out there and away from the concrete jungle is what it is all about, not the rack.

[bigpuddin43]

it all depends on what you consider the HUNT in hunting!! If your hunt is just to shoot something then QDM ruins that for you because you have to watch all those small bucks that offer the easy shot walk by!! But if you consider being in the woods, scouting, finding rubs and scrapes, and figuring out travel routes, and watching bucks chase does, and watching bigger bucks run of the younger ones. if thats what you consider hunting then QDM improves your hunt. To me the hunt is not about killing something its about the experience of being in the woods!! we take does for meat and let the bucks go! I watched 7 bucks all year and half olds and one button buck last year in a field for over an hour and a half at it is probably one of the most enjoybable days ive spent in the stand!! They were sparing and fighting and i never picked up the gun!! had everything from a basket 8 point to the button buck. had spikes 4s and a 6 all out at the same time!! Cant wait till this year they will all be 2 and a halfs plus saw a few 2 1/2s last year that should be some nice ones this year too!!

[Xi Bowhunter]

it all depends on what you consider the HUNT in hunting!! If your hunt is just to shoot something then QDM ruins that for you because you have to watch all those small bucks that offer the easy shot walk by!! But if you consider being in the woods, scouting, finding rubs and scrapes, and figuring out travel routes, and watching bucks chase does, and watching bigger bucks run of the younger ones. if thats what you consider hunting then QDM improves your hunt. To me the hunt is not about killing something its about the experience of being in the woods!! we take does for meat and let the bucks go! I watched 7 bucks all year and half olds and one button buck last year in a field for over an hour and a half at it is probably one of the most enjoybable days ive spent in the stand!! They were sparing and fighting and i never picked up the gun!! had everything from a basket 8 point to the button buck. had spikes 4s and a 6 all out at the same time!! Cant wait till this year they will all be 2 and a halfs plus saw a few 2 1/2s last year that should be some nice ones this year too!!
I enjoy all those things too, but the hunt is more than just getting a rack on the wall. People put too much emphasis on "trying" to "manage" the herd and miss what it is really all about. Enjoying the outdoors and getting away is what it should be all about. Not killing an animal and having the rack to brag to your buddys about....that is just the icing on the cake:D

[bigpuddin43]

I totally agree I am definatly not in it for the rack i could hunt the rest of my life and kill only does and be fine with me i just enjoy being outdoors and having a little meat on the table!! I harvested a 3 1/2 yr old 7 point this year that i believe would prove im not in it for the rack!!! As my buddy put it he was a SHORT BUS BUCK!! LOL:D

[moosehead rollins]

QDM is not a bad thing. Its working well at Ft. knox. Ft. knox could be better if it took care of some other problems. Yellowbank. and higginson-henry are suffering because of hunter overcrowding. Some of it is because of QDM...some of it is because some of the people in this forum can keep their mouths shut...magazines...Lack of places to hunt because the sport is turning into a rich mans sport. Please, spare me with the "there are some affordable leases out there" crap. Those will not last forever. The sport is dieing because of greed at every spectrum. I usually spend 1000 or so a year on hunting. It is now being spent on fishing. You cant lease the whole ocean and the fishing is always good.

[SmokeyBear]

In my opinion QDM should not be allowed on public hunting areas. QDM should be limited to private lands only. Public land hunters should be able to take any animal they want because what is considered a trophy to one may not mean much to another hunter. The "trophy" in my opinion should be the hunt itself and the quality of time spent in the woods with family and friends. Too much emphasis is being placed on the inches of antlers these days, and that is what is DESTROYING hunting. It has turned hunting, something that is supposed to be an enjoyable recreation activity, into a BIG MONEY MAKING BUSINESS. I absolutely hate what has happened to deer hunting over the last 10 to 15 years. All these "professional hunters", magazines and tv "hunting" shows have taken our great heritage of hunting and turned it into a cut throat big money business. My dad, brother and myself have taken several nice bucks off of public land here in KY and have done so for the last 25 years. There are nice bucks out there everywhere if you have the skills and patience to take one, even without these bullcrap QDM restrictions. I myself enjoyed deer hunting a lot more 10 to 15 years ago than I do now. The fun and enjoyment have almost been completly taken out of hunting these days for me because of all the hype over people fighting for leases, hunting rights on private lands, fighting for spots on public lands and stupid accusations that spread like wildfire anytime I take a nice deer. Dad's health has gotten to the point that he only hunts about 1 or 2 days a year now so I would say when he stops going I will get out of hunting for good. If my kids want to go when they get old enough I will take them but I seriously doubt that hunting will be even close to what it was when I was a kid, so my kids will probably not be that interested in it. In my opinion we have things like QDM and these so called "professional hunters" to thank for that.:mad::(

[slickhead slayer]

Public hunting is for everybody, why is it such a big deal that just a few public hunting spots offer QDM for the discerning hunter who wants to hunt mature bucks?
There is 10 times more public land that isn't under QDMA than is. If your not interested in hunting a QDMA spot, go to one where there are no restrictions.
I hear from anti-QDMA guys like you that its all about the hunt, not the horns. Then why are you bent out of shape about a public area that has QDMA restrictions?
And secondly, QDMA is much more than antler restrictions. Its the process of increasing the quality of the deer herd, allowing deer to reach closer to maturity, and keeping doe numbers in correlation with the healthy carrying capacity, plus much more.
How anyone can be against increasing the quality of the deer herd is astonishing to me.

[SmokeyBear]

Like I said, my dad, brother and I have taken several mature bucks on public land over the last 10-15 years (three of which would make the B&C book and several P&Y class animals for those of you that seem to only care about that). All I am getting at is that there are mature bucks out there even without this precious QDM if you have the skills and patience that it takes to get one. So if all you are wanting is inches of antler then that has been an option for those that are willing to dedicate the time and effort required to do that for a long time now here in KY, and I mean everywhere in KY. As far as QDM goes, I really couldn't care less either way. Hunting has been turned into a money making machine now and it will never be the same because this trend cannot be reversed. It is all about the antlers now to most "hunters" and that is exaclty why every year you read or hear about huge bucks being poached and even stolen from other hunters. You hunt your way and I'll hunt mine, I honestly could not remotely care any less about how or why anyone else hunts. Hunting and being in the outdoors are just obviously entirely different experiences and have entirely diffent meanings for me than it is for people like you. You do your thing and I'll do mine because again, I could not care any less about how or why you hunt.

[slickhead slayer]

. Hunting and being in the outdoors are just obviously entirely different experiences and have entirely diffent meanings for me than it is for people like you..

Your making assumptions, I never said how or why I hunt. I happen to believe that however people want to hunt, and why is their business. Thats goes for people who hunt for the rack as well.
You claim you don't care why people hunt, or for what reasons, but you said that people who trophy hunt are "destroying hunting".
I know trophy hunters who haven't used their buck tag in years, some 8-10 years. I think its hard to say a guy isn't in it for the experience when he hasn't shot a buck in 10 years.
My point is that plenty of public hunting exist for anybody that wants to shoot anything that walks, whats wrong with a few public places that exist for those who are a little more discerning in their choice?

[SmokeyBear]

I never said "trophy hunters are destroying hunting"...I said, "Too much emphasis is being placed on the inches of antlers these days, and that is what is DESTROYING hunting". There is nothing wrong with being selective with the use of your antlered deer tag. I myself will not take an immature buck. I will take a doe or two for meat and then I am selective with my antlered tag. But I honestly don't care if I ever take another deer, I just love being out there in the woods and enjoying nature and time spent in the field with family and friends. I am not meaning that trophy hunting is a bad thing. I am just saying that a "trophy" is in the eye of the beholder. To each their own is my way of looking at things. I am saying that all the emphasis on what a buck scores these days really is not conveying the right message to the next generation of hunters in my opinion. It really upsets me every season when I am in line at the butcher or at one of the local "hunter watering holes" and hear some butthead badmouthing another hunter by saying crap like "you should not have shot that deer, it is too young/small etc..." or "man he would have been a good one next year". None of us know what hunting means to another or what makes a successful hunt to another. Whatever it is about hunting that makes you happy and makes it enjoyable for you is what it is all about and I just don't think the hunting shows, magazines, etc of today are conveying that message. QDM is a tourism money making gadget that fish and wildlife departments are using to bring in more revenue, that is truly how I feel about QDM and I am sorry if that upsets some people but I know several people around here that agree with me on that point. Again, I am not against being selective with your buck tag. What I am trying to get across is that public land in KY, and let me stress this part...in my opinion, does not need QDM restrictions. The deer herd in KY is very healthy and there ARE mature bucks throughout our state and plenty of them are on public lands. All but two of the mature bucks that I have taken in KY I harvested on public lands. What I am saying is that the opportunity to "trophy hunt" and take a mature buck on public land in KY has been around throughout the state for several, several years now, even without the QDM restrictions.

[bigpuddin43]

Some people are getting trophy hunting and qdm mixed up! TRUE QDM is managing not for antlers but for a better age structure and better buck doe ratio!!! the anlter restrictions in a QDM plan are set because many of the hunters today cannot effectively estimate age on the hoof!! so to prevent MISTAKES in aging a buck they set an antler restriction that will protect MOST of the 1 1/2 and 2 1/2 yr old bucks!! QDM gets mixed in with TROPHY DEER MANAGEMENT too much!! there are major differences in the two!! so if we want to talk about QDM lets talk about it!! Anyone no matter what you are hunting for should not complain about QDM because lets face it the meat hunter you can take all the does you want!! so why shoot the little buck when u can take a doe that taste the same looks the same and is easy to hunt!! the trophy hunter most bucks will reach at least 3 1/2 which means that many will reach 4 1/2 or 5 1/2 so you can appreciate the nice rack they grew over the years and have your name in the B&C book or P&Y whatever!! plus with a better age structure it makes for a shorter more intense rut to force those big mature bucks to move during daylight to breed as many does as possible!! which if you just there for the experience you will be seeing bucks chasing does, bucks chasing bucks, fights, more scraping and rubbing activity, and more deer movement!! so what is the downfall for anyone!! if you say your a hunting for meat and you want that 1 1/2 old buck why not take a doe or two or three???? I just dont see a downfall i guess!!