"Traditional"

[aceoky]

We keep hearing(reading) the biggest complaint(other than having to share "their season"), for not wanting the cross-bow allowed is "tradition".

I thought perhaps it is time to "examine" that with some facts....

There is absoloutly NOTHING traditional about the compound bow; in fact it is a very modern invention! The cross-bow however is many CENTURIES old; so which IS tradiitional???? It's hard to imagine, that some would dispute that fact(almost as hard as the post saying "that everyone knows a cross-bow isn't a bow") :D

Or calling it a "cross-gun" ("guns" use a propellent; usually "gun powder" and fire "bullets" "slugs" etc. NOT broadheads, and also they kill from "shock" as well as blood loss and blood pressure loss) a cross-bow kills EXACTLY as a "bow" does, and fires an "arrow" (though shorter and called a "bolt", it's still an arrow) a rose.......

When the cross-bow was invented it was said" that surely this weapon is so deadly that it will end ALL WARS!!! (we all know how true that idea turned out to be!!!) The point?? It didn't end "all wars", nor will it end archery hunting here or elsewhere "as we know it"! There is simply no proof , or reason to believe that it will do so!

Since "they" want "tradition" to continue so badly, it seems that keeping things "as they are" is the only way of doing that; although IF they really meant it; they wouldn't want compound bows either!! :)

Something to think about???

[grinder]

in a way i agree, theres not much traditional about a compound. i guess thats why i hunt with recurves and longbows. that being said i'm sure i'll get bombarded as an "elitist snob". nothing could be farther from the truth. i hunt a
nd target shoot with people who use the same equipment as me because, well, we shoot the same type of course, we can talk bows,equipment etc. i know nothing about compounds, so the conversation would get pretty dull. he'd get tired of threading $10 knitting needle arrows through limbs at a 20 yard target, the same as i would get tired of missing 50 yard open shots. its just a different game with different rules.
i see you're point about when the x-bow was invented. i've read alot of history on medieval warfare.in 1346 at the battle of crecy the french were pretty smug that their crossbows that had a range of 350 yards would anniahlate the english soldiers and the longbows they carried. when it was all said and done the brits came out on top with about 100 dead, the french after repeated attacks into ranks of massed longbowmen, suffered losses estimated at 10,000 ! my book claimed the longbow effective at 280 yards! rapidity of fire ruled the day though, and the best of armor just would not deflect a 900 grain oak shaft cast from a 100# draw longbow. neat reading.
the problem i have with the new crossbow law is i'm afraid, that many who have never bowhunted will figure they can shoot at deer at any distance. just my opinion, and it ain't worth much. i sincerely hope i'm wrong

[grinder]

oh yeah, like many have said before, even with a compound, you do have to draw the bow in the presence of game, and that can be tricky. crossbows eliminate this step. i have gotten second shots with a longbow, that i would have never got with a crossbow though. sorta like the english flinging 10 arrows to the frenchies 1. i'm glad deer huntin's not warfare! i probably wouldn't last too long!

[shogan]

Look with a 90%+ Let off I can draw the bow when the game is pretty far off. And most of the fellows on tv do just that then they hold it for a long time. Then it's just a stregth match.

By your own argument longbows are made to shoot multiple arrows more swiftly allowing missing and repeatitive shots ((I knoow because I have taken them)).

But a crossbow demands that you get it on one shot because you won't get second one.

And as far as range well neither of us are shooting arrrows in the air hoping it will fall on a solider hundreds of yards off. We are both trying to with precision kill a specific deer. Both traditional bows have similar (((((EFFECTIVE KILL RANGE)))) that goes no further then 30-40yards and 40 is really pushing it for both bow and shooter and most of us should keep it under 30.

The incorrect assumption is that just because it's a bow laid on top of a stock with a stigger assembly (versus having the trigger assembly strapped to your arm and your arm is the stock) that folks will assume it has infinete range. Hog wash! If a few folks assumed that then they obvioiusly did not practice and they will learn in the first couple of shots and those folks do not represent the masses. Remember the masses are bow hunters like me and others on here who are not happy with inline bows and are ready to stop the strong man contest ((Or lay down a grand for 90%+ let off)).

We don't care that you use an inline why do you care if we use a crossbow?????????????????? And that is the question that gets you labeled as an elitist or someone not wanting to share.

Because how my weapon shoots a arrow different from yours should not matter to you. It would be like muzzle loader lasting for 4 months and the state says you know originally we stated you can not use the new break open barrel muzzle loader with shotgun primer but now you can and all the old style muzzle loaders going no way i'ts going to dessimate the herd. I'ts not a muzzle loader. It's not tradition. It's easier than what we use. Baring in mind most muzzle loaders are already using inline.

[grinder]

i personally feel my chances are better with a recurve than a compound or crossbow, simply because i've never used either. so we have no argument. good hunting!!

[aceoky]

You've made some great points grinder; and I commend you on how you've made them!

IMHO ; that's how this "whole mess" should have been "debated", with facts and even some "fears or opinions", instead of what we ended up with.....

I'd venture a bet, that EVERY weapon at some point has been used beyond it's effective range on deer(and turkeys, and most else as well); that's not the weapon's fault nor do I think it's the "norm" for hunters in any state.

I'd also submit, that the people that decide these issues are much better able to make decisions based on the facts and data that they receive than ANY of us here.

The FACT is: crossbows ARE traditional, MUCH more than compound, and when they're drawn isn't relevant in the least! So IF(as some have argued) THAT'S the problem, I hope it's now solved!

[grinder]

to be opposites we agree on alot! yeah, i too think the ones that decide are more informed on this than most on this site, and i certainly include myself. most of what i say is nothing more than my opinion. it bothers me when some use heresay and estimation and claim facts and statistics, some which have been proven false. and i'm not talking just one side. theres been trash talk on both sides. lying and namecalling only hurts the offenders cause.

[aceoky]

Yes , grinder, I agree, we are all hunters, and thus should remain "civil" to all!

:)

[Multidigits]

Wouldn't that be nice. Sit down to the table and talk out the differences. But the crossbow is such an evil weapon? We couldn't allow that in "OUR" season. It would destroy our season structure, our game populations, our sanity, etc. We just couldn't have that, so it appears we resort to any means available to discredit those trying to get the rule change passed on and allow the hunting to begin. Just this past week, the new tactic was a planned bombardment of the LKS headquarters to try and have me removed from the LKS and from the positions I hold within. Several of the key figures in the debate made the calls, and told lies about what I've said and what I've done. We even had the famous Mr. Strader making the call, and our own Walt and others who I won't ID for now. The good news is that it didn't work. This sn't a LKS issue and the anti's can't drag it into it, much to their dismay. We're winning this fight and will continue to do so because of failed tactics like these.

[gwhilikerz]

I decided to come back and edit. You people doing this kind of crap are making a big mistake. It will come back to bite you in the rear end.

[aceoky]

Multi; I'm sorry(and disgusted) to hear that ANYONE would "drop to such levels!" The good news is; I was raised to believe that what you do comes back on you(and sometimes ten-fold)!

SO if they lose their respective offices(etc.); then they'll have no one to blame but themselves!

Some people can't handle choice/change or "sharing" what they THINK is their own...BUT to get to THAT level of "stuff" is uncalled for ; and really shows that this ISN"T about what "they" claim at all!

But; what else can you do; when you have NO facts/data to support your opinions???

[grinder]

I decided to come back and edit. You people doing this kind of crap are making a big mistake. It will come back to bite you in the rear end.
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[shogan]

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[aceoky]

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:D

[grinder]

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

[Multidigits]

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[grinder]

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[gwhilikerz]

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Most sensible post you've made since Mar. 4th.:D